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Question, big dogs and self defense? (Read 17050 times)

Heavies

Question, big dogs and self defense?
« on: June 20, 2011, 07:59:57 PM »
Neighbors big a$$ dog jumps the fence, threatens my families safety, my dogs safety, and my safety.
I am talking BIG. I believe Alaskan Malimute. Looks like a fricken wolf. 

What to do?

Came this close to getting my gun.

Luckily me being so pissed scared the dog back over the fence.

Thoughts?

« Last Edit: June 20, 2011, 09:14:20 PM by Heavies »
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onfloat

Re: Question big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2011, 08:25:19 PM »
Depends on the behavior of the dog, but I would think you would be well within your right to take any and all actions to protect you and your family. Did you discuss it with your neighbor after the incident was over?
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Heavies

Re: Question big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2011, 09:13:14 PM »
Discussion was with high volume, choice words, and colorful metaphors.

I have been having much problems with these folks for a while now. Very inconsiderate people for sure. I have had to call HPD on them many times.
I have tried to be civil with no results. HPD can do next to nothing.
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AWS-GTAW

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2011, 11:13:14 PM »
I would use a baseball bat.  Is it possible to be its friend and feed it some treats?
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Funtimes

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2011, 12:13:59 AM »
Are you sure you aren't possibly exaggerating on the threatening safety portion :O.   If the dog took off, he's probably more scared of you, then you are of him.   Shooting your neighbors dog will make for a interesting event lol - so i recommend against it. I don't have time, but there are leash and animal control laws.  Contact them, see what they say.  Spray the dog with pepper spray imo (that was its original design) if you feel you need to fend him off.  One of most worrying parts of serving court documents was dealing with the dogs.  I have had to go on some properties while the dog was barking and looking mean as shit, but they were really just a big baby.  Dog treats go a long way lol.  For 99.9% of people, there isn't a dog you can own that will look away from a t-bone or dog treats :P.

Relevant rules can be found here: http://www1.honolulu.gov/council/ocs/roh/7.pdf the important portion is the 'strays'.   One thing though, don't let the dog become the weapon or victim for dealing with your shitty neighbors.  It's not his fault his owners are fucking garbage :(.   He may just want a friend and wants to come visit you lol. (no seriously!)


« Last Edit: June 21, 2011, 12:21:34 AM by Funtimes »
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Heavies

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2011, 01:23:55 AM »
Thank you for the replies and the info. 

The dog may be friendly, and it may not be.  I don't want to find out with the safety of my family. 

You have to realize this dog is not the size of a normal dog.  If it stood on its hind legs it probably be taller than me, and easily much larger than my wife.  I talking at least 70 lbs+.  I have been working a lot lately, and dead tired.   And, to be woken from a dead sleep with the wife screaming that the dog was on our property  was very unsettling.  Luckily, the dog was not mean, and pretty much listened to what I was telling it to do, which was to 'go home'.  But,  with an animal of this size, I don't care if it is naughty or nice, if it decided to attack there would have been some serious injury. 

Here is a pic I found on the net.  This one is fatter than the one we encountered, but the height looks about right.  Chest high for me..
http://www.carnivoraforum.com/index.cgi?board=discussion&action=print&thread=9769




If the dog was mean, and I had to bat, shoot it, or whatever, what charges would I face?  Knowing this state I probably would have been up sh_t creek. :(

After my immediate and unequivocal reprimand, back door neighbor erected a wooden board, thus blocking the access the dog had to jump over the fence.
I just hope they wise up. :P
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Funtimes

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2011, 02:13:16 AM »
Lol -- yeah dude, smashing the neighbors dog is probably going to have your ass at trial. I mean that stupid lady went to trial for a peacock... Imagine when star advertiser reads "Local Man smashes man's best friend in face, slaying fluffy puppy."  If he ran away when you went home, I would be willing to wager that the dog is not violent.  He is probably not given the attention he needs, not exercised, and not taken care of properly.  Those dogs are not the type to just sit around -- they need lots of exercise.
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Colt808

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2011, 05:29:48 AM »
Having kids of my own, I completely understand where you're coming from. BUT you do NOT want to shoot your neighbors pet. Even if justified, I can almost guarantee you'll get sued and likely never own a firearm again (after being charged with some B.S.).

Malamutes are intelligent and friendly dogs, so I'm almost positive you can easily befriend it. If that doesn't work, file a nuinsance complaint and call the Humane Society. Your neighbor will have to improve the fence, chain the dog, or get just rid of it.
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vooduchikn

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #8 on: June 21, 2011, 07:40:07 AM »
Pungi sticks....
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Old Guy

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2011, 09:12:49 AM »
Did you check with the Humane Society ? 

Did thay have anything meaningful to add?

Neighborhood Board?

Above all, DO NOT LOOSE YOUR TEMPER.  Play it COOL.

Got video camera?  Or regullar digital camera with Video.  Great evidence if it has to go to court.

If ALL else fails, do you have a lawyer/attorney that you can talk to?

By Law, maximum height of fence/wall permitted is 6 feet.

Unfortunately, if you have problems, file a police complaint First, before the neighbor does.

Keep us informed
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HiCarry

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2011, 09:48:20 AM »
Sticky situation with many of the pros and cons of defending yourself already mentioned.....I would add that if you choose to use pepper spray, maybe one with a dye would be useful to ID the dog after the fact....
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vooduchikn

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2011, 12:06:11 PM »
Quote from: Funtimes on June 21, 2011, 12:13:59 AM

Relevant rules can be found here: http://www1.honolulu.gov/council/ocs/roh/7.pdf the important portion is the 'strays'.   

And the section on penalties on the owner.

Eh, I know what I would do here, but I am not going to post it.  >:D

So you called the police? Did they show? Animal control? Need some more background.
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2aHawaii

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Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2011, 12:19:53 PM »
I just saw something on the Hawaii News Now website that may relate to this topic. Abercrombie signed 15 bills into law today one of which was:

Quote from: http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=14947965
Another, Senate Bill 1068, classifies killing or attempting to kill someone's pet without their consent as animal cruelty in the first degree.

Edit: Nevermind. The bill contains the text:
Quote from: http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2011/bills/SB1068_CD1_.pdf
Subsection (1) (b) shall not apply to:...

Conduct which the actor believes to be necessary to
avoid an imminent harm or evil to the actor, another
person, or an animal; provided that the harm or evil
sought to be avoided by such conduct is greater than
that sought to be prevented by this section and is
justifiable as provided in section 703-302 for choice
of evils; provided further that, for purposes of this
paragraph, as the justification described in section
703-302 shall also apply to conduct which the actor
believes to be necessary to avoid an imminent harm or
evil to an animal.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2011, 12:25:06 PM by 2aHawaii »
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BananaClip

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2011, 05:48:13 PM »
At my job we do a lot of work where we disconnect service when they don't pay.. A lot of times we have Dog Spray to fend off their family pets.. I even was put outta work for getting bit by a customers dog once for like a month from tenden damage in my hand..
Man that sux.. Thats why Will Ferrell, Adam Sandler, Jack Black, Ben Stiller ETC. make "Dry Humor" movies, so these lame people catch on...  :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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BananaClip

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2011, 05:51:32 PM »
Shux this is a good post... I would do things that I can't mention here.. No one, absolutely no one threatens the OHANA!! >:(
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"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth"- Genesis1:1 KJV

"The Truth Shall Set You Free"

"Once Blind But Now i See"

Kingkeoni

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2011, 06:10:13 PM »
Quote from: 2aHawaii on June 21, 2011, 12:19:53 PM
I just saw something on the Hawaii News Now website that may relate to this topic. Abercrombie signed 15 bills into law today one of which was:

Quote from: http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=14947965
Another, Senate Bill 1068, classifies killing or attempting to kill someone's pet without their consent as animal cruelty in the first degree.


Thats whats wrong with our crappy politicians.

Passing more animal cruelty laws instead of spending their time and effort on more meaningful issues.
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Your number one Option for Personal Security is a lifelong commitment to avoidance, deterrence, and de-escalation.

Someday someone may kill you with your own gun, but they should have to beat you to death with it because it is empty.

BananaClip

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2011, 06:31:32 PM »
Man, everytime I hear that name Abercrombie, I think of Sodom and Gomorrah.....Guess what happen to them :-\ God gives us Free Will and we spit all over it... Sorry kinda graphic...... >:(
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"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth"- Genesis1:1 KJV

"The Truth Shall Set You Free"

"Once Blind But Now i See"

Kingkeoni

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2011, 07:35:07 PM »
Quote from: BananaClip on June 21, 2011, 06:31:32 PM
Man, everytime I hear that name Abercrombie, I think of Sodom and Gomorrah.....Guess what happen to them :-\ God gives us Free Will and we spit all over it... Sorry kinda graphic...... >:(

Yep, that's the first thing he did while in office.

He took care of the homosexuals.

Thanks a lot whoever voted him in.  :thumbsup:
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Your number one Option for Personal Security is a lifelong commitment to avoidance, deterrence, and de-escalation.

Someday someone may kill you with your own gun, but they should have to beat you to death with it because it is empty.

PeaShooter

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2011, 10:32:14 PM »
I totally sympathize with Heavies' situation. I have a slightly different situation. My neighbors are very good owners, but they have a very bad and very large dog. He is aggressive towards everyone, and I am 98% sure if I ever entered his enclosure, he would try to kill me. My neighbors NEVER let that dog out of their yard, and very rarely let him out of the enclosure.

This past weekend, while I was at the Shooting Sports Fair, that large dog killed my favorite pet which had escaped and gone into its enclosure (I admit it is my fault). When I went to get the body, that dog took an attack stance to kill me. It was not the stance or mannerisms to intimidate or scare away a stranger.

My neighbors handle that dog as well as possible, but if that dog gets loose even once, it will be a bad situation. If it came into my yard, I think shooting it on sight would be totally justified...that is, if I could somehow get to a gun in time.
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Heavies

Re: Question, big dogs and self defense?
« Reply #19 on: June 22, 2011, 01:10:42 AM »
Peashooter,

That is sad.  Did the owner of the vicious dog make any effort to give you justice?

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