http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/08/15/us/surplus-military-equipment-map.html?_r=0

According to this interactive map by the (cough, spit) NYT, HPD has been given three MRAPS.

Never knew you guys on Oahu were such a pack of terrorists!

Great. Id rather see them in use than being left behind, tossed in the ocean or melted down like M14s. They should repaint them Dillon blue to be less mil looking.

So, has Kealoha issued any public announcements about why he asked for these?  It ought to be a great excuse.........

The HPD does not have a single military MRAP, much less 3 of them.

The HPD does not have a single military MRAP, much less 3 of them.

The Nu Yerk Times apparently has info that says otherwise.  Maybe not delivered yet?  I doubt HPD wants to discuss the matter one way or the other.

I'd keep an ear to the ground if I lived in Honolulu.  Unpaid parking tickets could be a bitch...............

Not the best suspension for comfort. I was stuck in one for 7+ hours going into Baghdad. Felt like the scene from Aliens where the colonial Marines dropped into the planet. It sucked. A bit overkill but when the HPD needs armored vehicle such as the situation in Pearl City Palisades where they needed one - the State had to put soldiers on AD to operate the thing, then they have to drive the thing there etc.
An internal armored vehicle for the HPD would be more efficient and faster to deploy.


imagine the vehicle weight tax

They're leaf springs so yeah not exactly comfort-oriented.

Upkeep + training on these things "in case something happens" is ridiculous IMO given the other assets on-island.

I don't know why everyone complaining about riding in an MRAP; the new  suspensions they retrofitted are wonderful.

The Nu Yerk Times apparently has info that says otherwise.  Maybe not delivered yet?  I doubt HPD wants to discuss the matter one way or the other.

I'd keep an ear to the ground if I lived in Honolulu.  Unpaid parking tickets could be a bitch...............

The HPD would have zero issues discussing such a matter.  They wouldn't and couldn't hide such information.  They do not have any military MRAPs, nor does any other county.  While I did say there are no military supplied MRAPs in Hawaii LE, I did not say that there are no armored vehicles in Hawaii as that is also no secret that there are 3 counties in Hawaii that have Lenco Bearcats and yes one is owned by the HPD.  Unpaid parking tickets, hardly the case.  Evacuating people safely from their homes when in the line of fire, or doing rescues for citizens or Officers, yep.  Nearly 6 years in service and it ain't out there stealing citizens souls or oppressing the people.  But the tinfoil hat stories are so much more interesting I guess, so feel free to carry on. 

....A bit overkill but when the HPD needs armored vehicle such as the situation in Pearl City Palisades where they needed one - the State had to put soldiers on AD to operate the thing, then they have to drive the thing there etc.
An internal armored vehicle for the HPD would be more efficient and faster to deploy.

It is no secret that the HPD has memorandums of agreements with State, Federal and the various branches of the Military so I will comment.  Yes the HPD had an agreement to utilize the National Guard which provided LAVs and drivers for certain uses, but as you mention, logistically it was not efficient, nor optimal.  I also agree with your earlier post in that I hate to see our tax dollars going to waste, especially when items such as armored vehicles can provide LE with many alternatives to keep themselves and the public safe.  Lets face it, most local LE agencies can't afford such vehicles that can really do a lot of good for communities.  In many instances, many good people may have been killed needlessly if not for the availability of armored vehicles in LE, but it is much cooler this day in age to put on the tinfoil hat and jump on the media blitz bandwagon.  Good to hear some like yourself are seeing it for what it is.   

Great. Id rather see them in use than being left behind, tossed in the ocean or melted down like M14s. They should repaint them Dillon blue to be less mil looking.

If it was painted blue, then it would look like NATO, not an improvement.

I think it's overdue for HPD to get a good armored vehicle for extreme situations and if it's free then all the better.  However don't think they would need 3 of them, would require more upkeep and expense.

But the tinfoil hat stories are so much more interesting I guess, so feel free to carry on. 

...but it is much cooler this day in age to put on the tinfoil hat and jump on the media blitz bandwagon.

Perhaps you have read Radley Balko's "Rise of the Warrior Cop: The Militarization of America's Police Forces." Could you please comment on whether or not you believe the information (and documentation) in that book is the result of a "tinfoil hat"? Thanks.

Perhaps you have read Radley Balko's "Rise of the Warrior Cop: The Militarization of America's Police Forces." Could you please comment on whether or not you believe the information (and documentation) in that book is the result of a "tinfoil hat"? Thanks.

I have not read that book, so I cannot comment even if I wanted to.  In reality I really don't like to engage in these discussions in this type of venue.  Unfortunately there is so much misinformation, monday morning quarterbacking and blatant undermining of certain agencies / topics that is hard not to attempt to shed some light of reason into topics.  Unfortunately it is much more comical for most to make off the wall comments and posts for the sake of entertainment that I sometimes feel compelled to give my own 2 cents.  Questioning the Government or authority is not wrong, bashing it without just cause is undermining the trust and faith in those who selflessly attempt to do the right thing and put it all on the line for their community and country.  Those who make these type of off color, or blanket type of posts and statements for the sake of personal entertainment or whatever their agenda are quite frankly akin to jumping into the same end of the pool as the Sharpton's of our society. 

HPD and it's personnel take the tough jobs of dealing with our community's criminal elements so that we don't have to.

The sad thing is that after they arrest and put these guys in jail, our justice / prison system is overcrowded and gets these criminals back out on the streets again.  So the cops that put their lives on the line to do the dirty work has to do the same thing over again.

C'mon give our HPD guys a break.

The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the wolf. He has fangs and the capacity for violence. The difference, though, is that the sheepdog must not, cannot and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheepdog who intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished and removed. The world cannot work any other way, at least not in a representative democracy or a republic such as ours.

Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn’t tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, “Baa.”

Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog"

Reference: http://www.killology.com/sheep_dog.htm

Here's a simple concept. How about if society behaves? Then we won't need all this crap. Yeah, in an ideal world of Care Bears and dancing GummyBears. But no the scum of our society continues to be dumbarses and do stupid stuff. For example, the three kids who lived in public housing, living off our taxpayer generousity were the same perps that robbed banks with guns. A slap in the face not only as taxpayers but as responsible gun owner-citizens. If I were to apprehend these guys would I go in with an ulumaika and a spear? Hell no. Police tactics evolve with technology and the ever evolving criminal threat. Not the same as the military. The military wouldn't be concerned about taking these guys to jail, they'd drop a JDAM on these perps while they are on Facebook bragging about all the paper they stole.
The key difference is what the police does with their equipment from the .mil. PID standards are different from the police and military. If you are curious about polce work, I;d suggest a ride-along or volunteer as a police officer. You will understand the requirements and standards. There's a reason why the HPD academy is 6+ mos long. There is a lot of training involved as the City wants to ensure they put the right, well-trained person on the street. In comparison look at the Army's basic training, its about 9 weeks long then you go to your MOS school.

HPD and it's personnel take the tough jobs of dealing with our community's criminal elements so that we don't have to.

I find your comment above troubling on a 2A forum, where in Hawaii we are prohibited from dealing with criminal elements, indeed would probably be in prison with them if we did have the temerity to defend ourselves.

Surf impugns that I may be some sort of Sharpton because i posted an interesting map showing where all the military equipment was going, and that some (MRAPS) was going to Hawaii,  He may be right that the NYT info is bogus.  So posting the link is tinfoil hat territory and an attempt to undermine HPD?  It should be ignored because he says so?    I posted it for the interest of the general Hawaii2A community, not to please HPD.

Yes, the cops have to deal with slime.  Quite the leap to go from questioning a news article about militarization of civilian police with military castoffs..........................I suppose you were trying to make some sort of point, but it irritated me in its tone.

Yeah, I am in a PO'd mood tonight for some reason.

Just saw this online

Obama: Time to review local police militarization

http://www.staradvertiser.com/news/breaking/20140818_Obama_sending_attorney_general_Holder_to_Missouri.html?id=271731911

I find your comment above troubling on a 2A forum, where in Hawaii we are prohibited from dealing with criminal elements, indeed would probably be in prison with them if we did have the temerity to defend ourselves.

I agree with you about this.  But this is our lawmakers and politicans' fault, not the HPD line of duty cop.  Those that voted for these anti-2a politicians can also share in the blame.

Yes, the cops have to deal with slime.  Quite the leap to go from questioning a news article about militarization of civilian police with military castoffs..........................I suppose you were trying to make some sort of point, but it irritated me in its tone.

My earlier post wasn't directed at you specifically but was just a general rant as mainstream media news now seems to be full of articles concerning the "militarization of the police".   robtmc, I don't know you in person but I suspect that you are / were in the armed forces and I have the utmost respect for you.

I suppose my earlier point is that in the same way we equip our soldiers with the best equipment and protective gear, it should be the same for the police force as well.  If HPD can get equipment that protects its police force better, then good for them.  Give them the best equipment especially if the feds are casting them off to the various states.  It's not like we have a surplus of cops in Honolulu... if I remember the stats correctly, we were (are?) 200-300 officers short.

I have been on HPD ride-alongs and only have a glimpse of what HPD has to deal with on a daily basis. I'm glad I don't have that job, can work regular hours (sort of) and be with my family most of the time in the day.  I don't think Honolulu is anywhere as bad a city as LA for example and I don't believe HPD officers are as aggressive as LAPD officers.

I certainly hope that when police and military do training exercises together, the distinct differences between the functions of police (keeping the peace) vs the military (annihilating the enemy) are not lost in the training.  If the police force is employed like the military against its own population, then this society has clearly gone awry. 

Yeah, I am in a PO'd mood tonight for some reason.

Yeah, well.. what can we do huh?  Too many Obummer worshipers in this state.

Just saw this online

Obama: Time to review local police militarization

http://www.staradvertiser.com/news/breaking/20140818_Obama_sending_attorney_general_Holder_to_Missouri.html?id=271731911

Yeah, when people that "could be Obama's sons" are facing the police, he's suddenly worried about military equipment in the hands of LE. 

Wasn't that long ago the same thing was happening to a rancher named Bundy and his family in Nevada.

Funny how priorities and concerns change when someone really cares about the parties involved.

^^^ Good point!

HPD and it's personnel take the tough jobs of dealing with our community's criminal elements so that we don't have to.

The sad thing is that after they arrest and put these guys in jail, our justice / prison system is overcrowded and gets these criminals back out on the streets again.  So the cops that put their lives on the line to do the dirty work has to do the same thing over again.

C'mon give our HPD guys a break.

Reference: http://www.killology.com/sheep_dog.htm

You are hitting at a huge crux of the problem, which incessantly frustrates LEO's.  Officers on the streets busting and putting their asses on the line, only to have the judicial system working on a catch and release program.  One side of the judicial system is doing their job and their other side is consistently letting the other side down. 

Here's a simple concept. How about if society behaves? Then we won't need all this crap. Yeah, in an ideal world of Care Bears and dancing GummyBears. But no the scum of our society continues to be dumbarses and do stupid stuff. For example, the three kids who lived in public housing, living off our taxpayer generousity were the same perps that robbed banks with guns. A slap in the face not only as taxpayers but as responsible gun owner-citizens. If I were to apprehend these guys would I go in with an ulumaika and a spear? Hell no. Police tactics evolve with technology and the ever evolving criminal threat. Not the same as the military. The military wouldn't be concerned about taking these guys to jail, they'd drop a JDAM on these perps while they are on Facebook bragging about all the paper they stole.
The key difference is what the police does with their equipment from the .mil. PID standards are different from the police and military. If you are curious about polce work, I;d suggest a ride-along or volunteer as a police officer. You will understand the requirements and standards. There's a reason why the HPD academy is 6+ mos long. There is a lot of training involved as the City wants to ensure they put the right, well-trained person on the street. In comparison look at the Army's basic training, its about 9 weeks long then you go to your MOS school.

Herein lies a huge problem.  We are a society of cry babies.  Everyone gets a medal or deserves a trophy.  Push the "easy button".  Entitlement at its best.  I remember the days that if I acted like a jackass and the popo slapped me upside the head and my father found out.....guess what?  My father would beat my ass also.  Not today in age.  Everyone wants to cry foul.  I am not talking abuse, but an overall lack of respect.  Society going ass backwards and we are all going to reap the rewards.

I appreciate your stance as it is not a popular one, especially on this forum, but it is not one we should ignore.  The HPD standards is light years ahead of any training standards from 99.9% of mainland counterparts.  We are lucky we live Hawaii.  These are our sons, daughters, etc.. and many seem to forget this.  Who are the biggest crying foul?  Those who are the least connected.  Hawaii is unique in that we have way too many family ties and the local HPD Officers who are the majority do not forget this.  We should not also. 

I find your comment above troubling on a 2A forum, where in Hawaii we are prohibited from dealing with criminal elements, indeed would probably be in prison with them if we did have the temerity to defend ourselves.

Surf impugns that I may be some sort of Sharpton because i posted an interesting map showing where all the military equipment was going, and that some (MRAPS) was going to Hawaii,  He may be right that the NYT info is bogus.  So posting the link is tinfoil hat territory and an attempt to undermine HPD?  It should be ignored because he says so?    I posted it for the interest of the general Hawaii2A community, not to please HPD.

Yes, the cops have to deal with slime.  Quite the leap to go from questioning a news article about militarization of civilian police with military castoffs..........................I suppose you were trying to make some sort of point, but it irritated me in its tone.

Yeah, I am in a PO'd mood tonight for some reason.

Take a break my friend.  While all is not roses, it is far from the problem that you are attempting to imply.  Lucky we live Hawaii.  There are far far far few problems here than elsewhere.  The HPD really does give a shit. 

Just saw this online

Obama: Time to review local police militarization

Quote from: jonjon on August 18, 2014, 09:23:10 PM

Just saw this online

Obama: Time to review local police militarization

http://www.staradvertiser.com/news/breaking/20140818_Obama_sending_attorney_general_Holder_to_Missouri.html?id=271731911

Clown shoes, plain and simple.  It has been that way since the very beginning.  Used car salesman at best.  Many people ignored this and here we are today.  Clown shoes.

Quote from: Jl808 on August 18, 2014, 09:29:39 PM

.....

Yeah, well.. what can we do huh?  Too many Obummer worshipers in this state.

The political bias here runs deep.  This is the worst state in the union when it comes to blindly towing the party line.