I thought the poll results were interesting. I am posting this as it has helped me better understand the context of the recent discussions here lately.

Members believe what they believe and it is what it is.

My hope is that we can get past this and continue a conversation where we can find common ground to continue support and defense of our second amendment rights.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/rampage/wp/2016/02/05/millennials-have-a-higher-opinion-of-socialism-than-of-capitalism/

As you can see, overall, 52 percent expressed a favorable view of capitalism, compared with 29 percent for socialism. Republicans, those in families earning more than $100,000, and people age 65-plus had an especially high regard for capitalism compared with socialism, but respondents in almost every demographic category demonstrated the same preference to some degree.

There were just two exceptions to this pattern: Democrats rated socialism and capitalism equally positively (both at 42 percent favorability). And respondents younger than 30 were the only group that rated socialism more favorably than capitalism (43 percent vs. 32 percent, respectively).

The millennial demographics is different from the previous generation. Is this a just factor of youth?  When we were young, were we not "rebellious" and felt that we knew more than our elders because we could set the clock on the VCR?

What are the attitudes of the millennial generation towards gun control / gun rights? Is a preference for "democratic socialism" incompatible with a preference for individual gun rights?

Feel free to discuss and please avoid personal attacks and refrain from turning this into a flame war. I will lock the thread if it gets to that point.

Okay so I said self WTF is a Millennial and it turns out I am one here are some links to see what generation you are, http://www.thecalculator.co/personality/What-generation-am-I-Generation-Calculator-206.html

http://www.careerplanner.com/Career-Articles/Generations.cfm

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/03/here-is-when-each-generation-begins-and-ends-according-to-facts/359589/

There is slight difference in generation beginning and end times between sources. 

I have a more favorable view of capitalism and pretty much abhor socialism maybe because I am a little older from the beginning of the millennial zone.

I don't have any sort of statistics on age and the evolution of opinions but I think it is possible that age might explain a lot of it. I agree with your assessment that as a younger person I thought I knew more than I did. Now I am older and sometimes still think I know more than I do but at least I know i know more than I used to. Personally I know that some of my opinions changed at least a little bit.

I am almost 33 so I just escaped being a millennial right?

On first look, socialism makes sense.  Who wouldn't want "free shit".....   That word "free" is VERY DIFFICULT to rebut.   

With age come that realization, for some people, that NOTHING IN THIS WORLD IS FREE....       It doesn't help that education does not teach these things to kids, and many never learn it, even as adults.

Aloha JI808,

The millennial demographics is different from the previous generation. Is this a just factor of youth?  When we were young, were we not "rebellious" and felt that we knew more than our elders because we could set the clock on the VCR?

From a geopolitical standpoint, the millennials were born after the fall of the Soviet Union and the end of the Cold War.  Hence, they never were constantly reminded on a daily basis how anything and everything socialist/communist was supposedly "evil."  In contrast, everyone born prior was indoctrinated through both education and the mass media that capitalism was somehow God's gift to the Free World.  This fact alone could help explain the demographic data results in your original post.


What are the attitudes of the millennial generation towards gun control / gun rights? Is a preference for "democratic socialism" incompatible with a preference for individual gun rights?

This is very interesting because even though a number of millennials show a more liberal tendency, it is still unclear if they are advocates of gun control as a whole.  Moreover, as many millennials are keen to such video games such as "Call to Duty" and the like, I would like to hope that they are at least partial to the 2nd Amendment.

As to your second question, I personally do not see any incapability between democratic socialism and the 2nd Amendment and always try to educate left leaning individuals of this.  Unfortunately, at least on this forum, instead of trying to gain 2nd Amendment allies among those partially sympathetic to socialism or have liberal views, there are those who reinforce this incompatibility, thereby, further alienating those on the left who are open to the maintenance of gun rights in this country.


Kuleana

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Just a reminder. Topic is about Millennials (and / or Democrats) that have a favorable view of socialism, not socialism itself.   And in how they relate to gun ownership.

Are the beliefs in gun rights and in "democratic socialism" compatible?

Just a reminder. Topic is about Millennials (and / or Democrats) that have a favorable view of socialism, not socialism itself.   And in how they relate to gun ownership.

I dunno how true, or if they are too stupid/uneducated to know that the big gubmint that comes with socialism is almost certain to be against personal firearm ownership.

The horror stories I hear and read about how distorted what is taught these days leaves me with little hope, but at least an undersanding how the survey results happened.  "History"?  Dead white guys.  Social justice is where it is at.

Let leftists teach your kids, see what you reap.

I make it a general rule to not converse with the left, but in this case since you seem to have misread what i wrote:

"the big gubmint that comes with socialism"  Big gubmints tend to distrust armed citizens.

Not All Socialists?  Perhaps, but desperately few modern socialist governments if any, and I do not give a shit to go look for them.

Aloha Robtmc,

I make it a general rule to not converse with the left, but in this case since you seem to have misread what i wrote:

"the big gubmint that comes with socialism"  Big gubmints tend to distrust armed citizens.

Not All Socialists?  Perhaps, but desperately few modern socialist governments if any, and I do not give a shit to go look for them.

You are absolutely correct.

However, even nations who practice capitalism, albeit crony capitalism, also are prone to restricting gun ownership.  The Philippines under the US backed Marcos regime did not allow gun ownership to its citizens.  Consequently, I will add to your point by saying any nation that has a big government, even a nation that practices capitalism, does not necessarily translate to citizens having the right to bear arms.

By-the-way, I am not a leftist, but a political and economic ideological pragmatist.     


Kuleana

OK, we be on the same page.

Big gubmint of any sort is bad news.  Been the mantra of the traditional (not current McCain style) right for a long time.

We must not forget that theres a huge difference between capitalism and CRONY capitalism which is what we have now. I feel the CRONY part doesnt get discussed enough.

LOL!  Wow, I hope this was meant as a satire.  This is probably what the left is arguing against when they rail against the "evils of capitalism" (let me clarify, "crony capitalism"). 

When the interests of government and the interests of big business align more than less, then this is the big government influence that money can buy.

Bwahahaha i literally laughed so hard at this vid. Its so funny because its true......... *laughter fades as i shook my head in disappointment*

There are more videos with different characters. I've had to deal with Kaptain Korn recently when repairing ethanol poisoned chainsaw and line trimmer. All the fuel lines were rotted and carbs gummed up, and basically have to throw away the line trimmer.

I think older people have been more successfully indoctrinated because they experienced the last salad days of empire when things actually worked as promised and people weren't struggling just to meet their basic needs. They carry with them that nostalgia and fading hope that the good old days will come back, whereas millenials have grown up in a decaying system and have a much more difficult time imagining a brighter future. They realize they will never have what their parents had, and are fed up with unrealistic expectations of the previous generation that basically had a giant capitalist orgy and stuck them with the bill.

"When I was your age blabidy blah blah blah..."

Yeah, thanks for the deficit spending Grandpa. It's going to be a lot of fun never paying that off.

I would second the point that socialism as a political philosophy in and of itself is not anti gun. Kuleana makes very salient points in that most forms of government could end up anti gun.

Intelligence certainly does come with age but I also find that it comes with stubbornness. Case in point, I tried to take my grandma (about 80 at the time) to a mexican restaurant. She said no, that she didn't like mexican but then admitted she never tried it.

When it comes to the leftist education I also weigh that against the eduction of the next last generation, and of the generation before that. If I am going to have my eyes opened that the current generation is being brainwashed by leftists to like socialism then, to be objective, I must also consider that the previous generation was brainwashed to hate socialism and communism. Not simply for its political philosophy but also for the purposes it served as propaganda against out enemies of the time. It is easier to garner support against the USSR during the cold war when you have more people believing that it is evil.

So while I consider the intelligence of my seniors who have lived through more, I also consider that they were raised with a certain mount of indoctrination as well. Because of this I try to look at socialism fairly and objectively based on its political philosophies and not based on how violent some were in the past because that would taint all systems. If I were to consider Stalin, Hitler, etc. as proof that socialism were bad, then I would be forced to consider that our own democratic federalist republic is bad as well for our own violent past.

I think younger people are often more optimistic which might explain them having a more favorable opinion of socialism. They haven't lived through the evils of any socialism and they haven't lived through any of the anti socialism indoctrination.

You know, I was just thinking...

China probably has a more extreme form of cronyism because of the extreme power in the hands of its ruling party.  The ruling party has absolute control and one has to have the approval / favor of the officials in charge in order to do any sort of economic activity there.

Of course, they hang some government officials from time to time because they got caught taking bribes.  Examples below.

China Executes Corrupt Hangzhou and Suzhou Officials (2011)
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-14197485

China's Crazy Executions Don't End Public Corruption (2013)
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/world-report/2013/07/10/chinas-crazy-executions-dont-end-public-corruption

China Overwhelmingly Supports Death Penalty for Corrupt Officials (2014)
http://thediplomat.com/2014/11/china-overwhelmingly-supports-death-penalty-for-corrupt-officials/

Why China Executes So Many People (2013)
http://www.theatlantic.com/china/archive/2013/05/why-china-executes-so-many-people/275695/

I found the last article to raise more questions about the executions and whether it is actually working out for / backfiring on the regular Chinese person.

........The millennial demographics is different from the previous generation. Is this a just factor of youth?  When we were young, were we not "rebellious" and felt that we knew more than our elders because we could set the clock on the VCR?.............

I think it's because those lazy azz mofos are used to getting things given to them and not having work for them all the while someone is telling them it's not their fault.