not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done (Read 40604 times)

ren

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #100 on: December 24, 2016, 11:35:25 PM »
Let me rephrase, I am not aware of any such cases. Are you aware of any cases where someone who was denied a CCW got killed or seriously injured?

"awaiting" for her permit then was killed http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/06/10/no-one-helped-her-nj-woman-murdered-by-ex-while-waiting-for-gun-permit.html

and we know what happened to Dr. Martin Luther King
http://bulletsfirst.net/2014/01/20/racist-gun-control-laws-denied-martin-luther-king-jr-right-defend/

Heavies

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #101 on: December 25, 2016, 05:42:49 AM »
HPD may not be immune from "being sued", but virtually immune from any consequences, especially when it comes down to gun rights issues.  It has been proven time and time again.  It would have to go to the highest court to be overturned, the definition of infringement.

changemyoil66

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #102 on: December 25, 2016, 07:24:56 AM »
Anyone can sue anyone for any reason. But whether they win is another story.

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punaperson

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #103 on: December 25, 2016, 07:56:46 AM »
How do you come to the conclusion that police are immune? They sure aren't immune from other lawsuits.
I didn't claim they were immune from lawsuits. My whole point, clearly stated, which you ignore again and again, is that they are immune from any consequences of any lawsuit, even if the lawsuit is successful. I gave you the example of the Washington, D.C. PD having no consequences after their policy was ruled unconstitutional as an example and you failed to respond.

Let's take an example of a successful public lawsuit against HPD. So some cop (a friend of yours?) roughs up some lesbians in a public store because they are kissing and apparently he thinks he can justify threatening them because of his astute legal knowledge of the anti-lesbian-kissing-in-public section of HRS. They sue. They win a pile of money. What negative consequence ensued for any member of HPD? That's right, not one single fucking thing. The cop himself, oh, he "retired". What a coincidence. Did any public body hold a hearing to determine if the now-retired cop should face any consequences of any sort, including rescinding part or all of his pension? We all know the answer: NO! All that happened is some taxpayer money was transferred to some people who had been subjected to some asshole rogue cop bullying women. I wonder if they even bothered to notify all officers via some communication: "Uh, people kissing in public is NOT a crime. Do NOT threaten to arrest them. Do NOT throw them to the ground. Carry on." So, please tell us, what were the consequences of that lawsuit that any member of HPD had to fear?

punaperson

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #104 on: December 25, 2016, 08:37:27 AM »
Let me rephrase, I am not aware of any such cases.

I see, you can claim to state a fact, used as a premise in an argument, but once you are called on it and asked to provide evidence for claimed fact then you backtrack and tell us that that was only your made up opinion based on nothing at all except your "awareness". We all know from reading many of your posts that you are not aware of a lot of things, so please in the future do not claim as facts shit that you just make up.

Are you aware of any cases where someone who was denied a CCW got killed or seriously injured?

1. How would anyone know if someone who got "killed or seriously injured" was denied a CCW? The case of Carol Bowne, referred to above, was only known publicly because her family was outraged and went public. Oh, and what were the consequences for the cops that denied her her permit? That's right: zero.
2. Why should the criteria be "killed or seriously injured"? How about "victim of a crime which may have been prevented or minimized had the victim be armed"? Please justify your criteria of "killed or seriously injured". Go ahead, "rephrase it".
3.You are a minor step away from the actual policy of the Hawaii police chiefs wherein a person has to PROVE a high probability of likely crime victimization that could ONLY be prevented by carrying a firearm outside their home (yeah, that's right, people have been told to "move" rather than be given a CCW license as a solution to a documented threat [admitted anecdote: the cops did not admit to this claim of a denied licensee when asked, so it is only her word... the cops didn't put that in writing, it was an oral communication]).
4. There is no point in making the criteria for "a wrong" in Hawaii "denied a CCW" because everyone knows there is no point in applying because no one ever is granted one (unless you "just happen" to be a judge), so it's just a waste of time and money. The criteria should at least be "victim of a crime who would have carried a weapon had it been possible to carry one legally".


The thin line is the line between making the right call and making the wrong call, denying someone's civil rights or not.

Uh huh. And you're claiming that every single person in Hawaii who has applied for a CCW license, and been denied the right to "bear arms" has been the "right call" by the cops and no one has been denied their "civil rights"? Denying someone their civil rights is ALWAYS the "wrong call". Yet, that is what they do. And they do it with impunity.

You wanna make the constitutional argument? Go ahead, I support that but as far as HPD is concerned, they are following state law and case precedent so your unconstitutional argument doesn't convince anyone but us.

No, they are not "following state law". They are interpreting state law a particular way, arbitrarily and capriciously, at their whim and pleasure. Thus they can interpret state law one way and issue a judge a CCW license because, well, "judge", and not issue a CCW license to anyone else because, well, "fuck you, you serf, who the fuck do you think you are". And yes, the fact that there are a majority of Hawaii judges and Ninth Circuit judges who happen to be fascist civilian-disarmament advocates who mendaciously produce "precedents" which justify "regulations" that are de facto "bans" is a difficult to overcome problem.

What job is it? It is their job as issuer of permits.

I believe a more accurate term is "NONissuer of permits", or even more accurately "elite fascist bullies enforcing "laws" in whatever way we arbitrarily choose".

ren

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #105 on: December 25, 2016, 11:27:09 AM »
I don't think you can sue a PD for a crime that happened. They respond to crimes. Try to prevent crimes. We've become so litigious that less people are bold enough to take responsibility for their own actions. Do I carry in my home. No. If someone invades my house just to steal a TV and I shoot them I wouldn't want to get sued or go to jail. How do I know if that person wants to harm me or steal my TV? No one knows prior to the event except the perpetrator.

London808

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #106 on: December 25, 2016, 11:43:59 AM »
The police department is not Duty bound to protect you. : Warren v. District of Columbia

Waiting periods are constitutional : sylvester vs harris

You dont have the right to carry outside your home  : Peruta v. County of San Diego

Operating within the law gives the police immunity.

:stopjack:
"Mr. Roberts is a bit of a fanatic, he has previously sued HPD about gun registration issues." : Major Richard Robinson 2016

punaperson

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #107 on: December 25, 2016, 12:55:37 PM »
You dont have the right to carry outside your home  : Peruta v. County of San Diego
Peruta v. County of San Diego: You don't have a Constitutional right to carry concealed outside your home.

z06psi

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #108 on: December 25, 2016, 04:23:47 PM »
I hate to say this to y'all but I cannot wait to move back to GA in 16 months.

punaperson

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #109 on: December 25, 2016, 09:36:57 PM »
I hate to say this to y'all but I cannot wait to move back to GA in 16 months.
Who wouldn't want to move from Hawaii to the United States of America?

z06psi

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #110 on: December 25, 2016, 10:00:18 PM »
Who wouldn't want to move from Hawaii to the United States of America?


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aieahound

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #111 on: December 26, 2016, 02:09:21 AM »
Who wouldn't want to move from Hawaii to the United States of America?

Me.
The more a person hates, the more the object of their hatred hates them back. - Itachi Uchiha

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Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #112 on: December 26, 2016, 06:21:43 AM »
As much as I love living here, I love the Big Island even more so. I will probably be moving back to the Big Island when I retire. With that said My wife and I have been discussing moving back to the mainland instead. Both of us are happy here but we are disappointed in the way this state is run. With all our discussions we will probably end up staying but I can't believe we actually discussed the mainland as much as we have.

Arizona and Utah actually has some attraction for me due to the gun situation and Ohana. I will not go back to Kalifornia under any condition even though most of my Ohana is there.
Officially Retired and living in the free state of Arizona.

z06psi

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #113 on: December 26, 2016, 06:50:55 AM »
When you can get 34 acres for 120k and the state government leaves you alone it's a no brainer.

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punaperson

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #114 on: December 26, 2016, 06:58:50 AM »
When you can get 34 acres for 120k and the state government leaves you alone it's a no brainer.
Just out of curiosity, what sort of real estate can be purchased on Oahu for $120k? [Where's the coffee spitting emoticon?] Dave? Does any of that Oahu real estate come with a "government-mostly-leaves-you-alone" provision? :stopjack:

punaperson

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #115 on: December 26, 2016, 07:22:47 AM »
You dont have the right to carry outside your home  : Peruta v. County of San Diego
Peruta v. County of San Diego: You don't have a Constitutional right to carry concealed outside your home.

I should have more correctly written: Peruta v. County of San Diego: You don't have a Constitutionally-guaranteed right to carry concealed outside your home.

I think everyone here knows that our rights pre-exist the Constitution(s) and any government, and are NOT created nor granted by them, as has been ruled by the SCOTUS. The Bill of Rights merely confirms certain rights and that government may not infringe them.

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Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #116 on: December 26, 2016, 07:34:25 AM »
Just out of curiosity, what sort of real estate can be purchased on Oahu for $120k? [Where's the coffee spitting emoticon?] Dave? Does any of that Oahu real estate come with a "government-mostly-leaves-you-alone" provision? :stopjack:
Was this question for me? You quoted z06psi so I am a little confused.
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whynow?

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #117 on: December 26, 2016, 07:47:17 AM »


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Before my wife passed on, I thought about moving to the Cedar City or St. George area of UT.  Now, I will live and die here no matter what the state throws at us in the form of violating our 2A civil rights which I will defend.  Although my spirit will be with my Lord and Savior and my wife, my remains will be interred with hers.  I pray that our new federal government will severely punish states and cities that violate any 2A rights including games to make honest citizens jump through hoops like animals to exercise their individual rights, before it gets out of hand.

punaperson

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #118 on: December 26, 2016, 08:14:33 AM »
Was this question for me? You quoted z06psi so I am a little confused.
Well, it was to anyone really, but since you self-identify as a real estate agent I thought you might have accurate information immediately available.

So, what can a person get on Oahu for $120k? I mean real estate-wise...  :shaka:

dogman

Re: not buying any more firearms till RapBack crap is done
« Reply #119 on: December 26, 2016, 08:20:10 AM »
Well, it was to anyone really, but since you self-identify as a real estate agent I thought you might have accurate information immediately available.

So, what can a person get on Oahu for $120k? I mean real estate-wise...  :shaka:
A parking stall?