http://khon2.com/2017/01/31/heco-plans-to-bring-three-oahu-solar-farms-online-by-2019/

wouldn't it be better? No need for land. Allow easier entrance for new solar residential systems.
THoughts?

http://khon2.com/2017/01/31/heco-plans-to-bring-three-oahu-solar-farms-online-by-2019/

wouldn't it be better? No need for land. Allow easier entrance for new solar residential systems.
THoughts?

Nope, the current grid is not designed for residential solar. Solar as a grid tie system is the worst type of green energy as it requires almost the same amount of fuel to be burnt.

Someone explained it to me like such.
Current system: one way road
PV additions:  needs to be a 2 lane road. 

Lots of changes and upgrades would need to happen. 
The real question is why didn't HECO prepare beforehand.

Someone explained it to me like such.
Current system: one way road
PV additions:  needs to be a 2 lane road. 

Lots of changes and upgrades would need to happen. 
The real question is why didn't HECO prepare beforehand.

No need to.  They can happily charge us the highest prices in the nation for electricity.

Nope, the current grid is not designed for residential solar. Solar as a grid tie system is the worst type of green energy as it requires almost the same amount of fuel to be burnt.

can you explain it? I'm trying to understand it. Is it due to the manufacturing of PV panels?

can you explain it? I'm trying to understand it. Is it due to the manufacturing of PV panels?

Lets get some math up in here (simple numbers to make it easy)

Pre solar HECO had 100 customers all of them paying $2 a month
 $200 a month income, $100 goes to fuel $50 to maintenance and $50 to employees.

Solar comes out, 50% of their customers get solar, They get so much solar that they over generate enough to Zero their bill each month, HECO can reduce its fuel bill by 25% during the day but its the same at night,
They have to burn a high amount of fuel during the day to stop brownouts caused by bad weather and or clouds blocking customers solar panels. They burn the same amount at night because solar dont work in the dark.
$100 from non solar + ZERO from solar customers = $100.    : $87.5 for fuel + 50 for maintenance and $50 to employees.  = $87.50 loss.
HECO increases costs to customers by 100% to make up for lost customer



I know the number are simplified and its not exzacley how it works BUT its enough to get the point across as to why solar is a bad choice of green energy, Fuel still gets burnt for those customer who have solar. Costs go up for those that dont. no extra income is available for upgrades to systems.

Im waiting for TESLA wall to come out before buying solar. 100% of grid

Lets get some math up in here (simple numbers to make it easy)

Pre solar HECO had 100 customers all of them paying $2 a month
 $200 a month income, $100 goes to fuel $50 to maintenance and $50 to employees.

Solar comes out, 50% of their customers get solar, They get so much solar that they over generate enough to Zero their bill each month, HECO can reduce its fuel bill by 25% during the day but its the same at night,
They have to burn a high amount of fuel during the day to stop brownouts caused by bad weather and or clouds blocking customers solar panels. They burn the same amount at night because solar dont work in the dark.
$100 from non solar + ZERO from solar customers = $100.    : $87.5 for fuel + 50 for maintenance and $50 to employees.  = $87.50 loss.
HECO increases costs to customers by 100% to make up for lost customer



I know the number are simplified and its not exzacley how it works BUT its enough to get the point across as to why solar is a bad choice of green energy, Fuel still gets burnt for those customer who have solar. Costs go up for those that dont. no extra income is available for upgrades to systems.

Im waiting for TESLA wall to come out before buying solar. 100% of grid

OK got it 
I read that the Tesla wall i snothing more than lithium ion batts. They are safer than lithium polymer batts but require a certain charging cycle.

The reason I didn't get residential solar except for a solar water heater is I'm not convinced that most of these units can withstand even a CAT 1 hurricane without tearing off from your roof and causing even more damage.  I would like to hope that the panel frames are screwed into roof joists and not just the plywood.
Also the panels offered are bulky and inefficient compared to new innovations like solar tiles, cloth etc. that don't stick up from the roof like panels.  Wonder whatever happened to nuclear fusion technology for energy.

Wonder whatever happened to nuclear fusion technology for energy.

I'll let you know once I hit 88mph...





thanks again Doc...I'm going back to get the sports almanac

HECO was allowing customers installing solar to hook their system to the grid. 

The tariff this fell under was NEM -- Net Energy Metering.

https://www.hawaiianelectric.com/clean-energy-hawaii/producing-clean-energy/net-energy-metering

During the day, the extra kWh was sold back to HECO and used to supplement the power HECO produced for daytime customers.

At night, the solar customers consumed HECO-generated power.

At the end of the billing period (~ a month), most solar owners had sold back enough daytime excess energy to offset the amount they consumed at their homes at night, so their bill was $18/mon -- the minimum HECO charged for administrative costs.

The per kWh price HECO paid for solar-generated energy was much less that the price per kWh they charge customers.

HECO has stopped this tariff (category) of billing because the percentage of customers with PV was at the maximum they thought they could buy energy from and still be able to get paid enough to maintain the generation capacity needed for standard days, cloudy days and nights. 

Solar farms are simpler.  Just like regular generators, they produce energy which is distributed in one direction to many consumers.  They can feed variable usage needs of customers unlike individual solar systems.  Whoever needs more power each day gets what they need.  Also, individual users can't exceed the production capacity of the solar farm, unlike their home system with a fixed amount of generation capacity..

OK got it 
I read that the Tesla wall i snothing more than lithium ion batts. They are safer than lithium polymer batts but require a certain charging cycle.

The other way around, lithium polymer is safer than lithium ion. There are a few other chemistries in various stages of developments well. Not sure what the Tesla wall is made of, but likely a lithium based battery.

Once I get a house, I am thinking of making a solar system that is off grid but does not store electricity. Basically use solar power to power a/c units on the warm days. Not sure how they bleed the extra but since a/c is one of the biggest power drains it you just used it to cool the house during the day that might be a worthy investment that doesn't require HECO permission or as much work. It could also heat the water heater during the day, and have a switch change sources at night.

The other way around, lithium polymer is safer than lithium ion. There are a few other chemistries in various stages of developments well. Not sure what the Tesla wall is made of, but likely a lithium based battery.

Once I get a house, I am thinking of making a solar system that is off grid but does not store electricity. Basically use solar power to power a/c units on the warm days. Not sure how they bleed the extra but since a/c is one of the biggest power drains it you just used it to cool the house during the day that might be a worthy investment that doesn't require HECO permission or as much work. It could also heat the water heater during the day, and have a switch change sources at night.

off grid and not store power?
you ever punctured a 6S LiPo battery? I have. Instant Yoga Flame
Lithium ions are found in your mobile phones and laptops. They are much more stable and safer than LiPos watch video below

off grid and not store power?
you ever punctured a 6S LiPo battery? I have. Instant Yoga Flame
Lithium ions are found in your mobile phones and laptops. They are much more stable and safer than LiPos watch video below

Yes, off the grid but not to store power. Basically only to run things during daylight.


Not sure which battery is mentioned in the video though it could have been one of the recalled ones. Here is a link with more about li-ion vs li-polymer. They are more similar than I previously recalled but li-ion is not safer.
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/the_li_polymer_battery_substance_or_hype

You don't have to get a Li-ion battery to store there are many safe long term storage high cycle options out there.  The only reason we use li-ion is cause its compact and light.  You don't need that if its not portable and space isn't an issue.

Yes, off the grid but not to store power. Basically only to run things during daylight.


Not sure which battery is mentioned in the video though it could have been one of the recalled ones. Here is a link with more about li-ion vs li-polymer. They are more similar than I previously recalled but li-ion is not safer.
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/the_li_polymer_battery_substance_or_hype

the type of battery is stated in the video title. Its not a recalled batt but it is the nature of LiPo. Expose the cell's innards to air and poof... Yoga Flame. I have several packs and have had a few different types of LiPo chargers

Probably need to have a lot of panels to power AC units, refrigerators, and such with out a storage system of some kind.   If more than one item cycles on at the same time I would think there would be problems.  Interesting if it works.

Lithium Nano-Phosphate  supposed to be safer battery.

Probably need to have a lot of panels to power AC units, refrigerators, and such with out a storage system of some kind.   If more than one item cycles on at the same time I would think there would be problems.  Interesting if it works.

I think that if the air conditioner or water heater both kicked on at the same time and the draw was too much they would just not run or they would run at low power. I wouldn't run the refrigerator though, probably just water heater and air conditioner. Perhaps a clothes dryer, those are all big consumers of electricity. Of course for hot water, a solar water heater might make more sense.

I have a solar powered AC system, 100% Solar powdered, 12000 BTU,

I have a solar powered AC system, 100% Solar powdered, 12000 BTU,

            howzit London808. Is your A/C a DIY or store bought?