Prelude to SSS #2 (Read 9146 times)

zippz

Prelude to SSS #2
« on: February 23, 2017, 11:32:49 AM »
I'll be returning to Sig Sauer Academy in May to work on my Sig Master Instructor in Pistol and Rifle (I think shotguns should be relegated to just shooting birds).  This will be my training log for the next 2 months and Q/A discussions for anyone needing help with their training.  As you can tell, I'm big on spending more time and money on training versus equipment.

Background:  I was a military competitive shooter now retired and took firearms training at the police academy, Front Sight, various NRA instructor and training counselor classes, and other clinics.    I completed the Sig Instructor classes last year (https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=22710.0) which I enjoyed very much learning different techniques in operating/shooting firearms and instructing students.  I've found the class improved my speed, accuracy, weapons handling, and confidence a lot.

Current:  I haven't been shooting much in the past year as I've been doing more teaching, coaching, and organizing than shooting.  I've learned a lot in those areas but my shooting skills have degraded...a little slower, less accurate, and I forgot how to do some of the techniques.  I have trouble keeping my pistol groups on a sheet of paper at Koko Head and my one handed shooting is terrible.  My rifle is still pretty good, just a little slower on everything.  As far as teaching, I've just done NRA classes which have a whole different technique than Sig Sauer philosophy...strict by the book versus encouraging flexibility.

Training plan:
Practice live fire at least twice a week.
Dryfire practice at least twice a week.
Watch youtube videos to refresh my techniques.
Teach tactical pistol clinics and coaching.
Attend 3 USPSA events.
Compete in a CMP pistol match.
Attend a pistol/rifle class and mainland match if possible.

changemyoil66

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2017, 01:25:28 PM »
I'll be returning to Sig Sauer Academy in May to work on my Sig Master Instructor in Pistol and Rifle (I think shotguns should be relegated to just shooting birds).  This will be my training log for the next 2 months and Q/A discussions for anyone needing help with their training.  As you can tell, I'm big on spending more time and money on training versus equipment.

Background:  I was a military competitive shooter now retired and took firearms training at the police academy, Front Sight, various NRA instructor and training counselor classes, and other clinics.    I completed the Sig Instructor classes last year (https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=22710.0) which I enjoyed very much learning different techniques in operating/shooting firearms and instructing students.  I've found the class improved my speed, accuracy, weapons handling, and confidence a lot.

Current:  I haven't been shooting much in the past year as I've been doing more teaching, coaching, and organizing than shooting.  I've learned a lot in those areas but my shooting skills have degraded...a little slower, less accurate, and I forgot how to do some of the techniques.  I have trouble keeping my pistol groups on a sheet of paper at Koko Head and my one handed shooting is terrible.  My rifle is still pretty good, just a little slower on everything.  As far as teaching, I've just done NRA classes which have a whole different technique than Sig Sauer philosophy...strict by the book versus encouraging flexibility.

Training plan:
Practice live fire at least twice a week.
Dryfire practice at least twice a week.
Watch youtube videos to refresh my techniques.
Teach tactical pistol clinics and coaching.
Attend 3 USPSA events.
Compete in a CMP pistol match.
Attend a pistol/rifle class and mainland match if possible.

I dry fire every night.  While I'm watching TV in between commercials.  But not on the cool equipment that you got.

RSN172

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2017, 05:53:45 PM »
 I am going to NV in March for 5 days, so I have been doing live fire practice 3 times a week.  Mostly drawing from concealment and firing from the hip at 3 to 7 yards trying to put 2 shots center mass.
Happily living in Puna

Surf

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2017, 08:31:21 PM »
I'll be returning to Sig Sauer Academy in May to work on my Sig Master Instructor in Pistol and Rifle (I think shotguns should be relegated to just shooting birds).  This will be my training log for the next 2 months and Q/A discussions for anyone needing help with their training.  As you can tell, I'm big on spending more time and money on training versus equipment.

Background:  I was a military competitive shooter now retired and took firearms training at the police academy, Front Sight, various NRA instructor and training counselor classes, and other clinics.    I completed the Sig Instructor classes last year (https://2ahawaii.com/index.php?topic=22710.0) which I enjoyed very much learning different techniques in operating/shooting firearms and instructing students.  I've found the class improved my speed, accuracy, weapons handling, and confidence a lot.

Current:  I haven't been shooting much in the past year as I've been doing more teaching, coaching, and organizing than shooting.  I've learned a lot in those areas but my shooting skills have degraded...a little slower, less accurate, and I forgot how to do some of the techniques.  I have trouble keeping my pistol groups on a sheet of paper at Koko Head and my one handed shooting is terrible.  My rifle is still pretty good, just a little slower on everything.  As far as teaching, I've just done NRA classes which have a whole different technique than Sig Sauer philosophy...strict by the book versus encouraging flexibility.

Training plan:
Practice live fire at least twice a week.
Dryfire practice at least twice a week.
Watch youtube videos to refresh my techniques.
Teach tactical pistol clinics and coaching.
Attend 3 USPSA events.
Compete in a CMP pistol match.
Attend a pistol/rifle class and mainland match if possible.
Sounds like a plan.  I am also doing my re-certs on the armorer and Master courses in May.  I should be qualing quarterly but it just isn't practical out here.  We had a good time in the Exeter and Portsmouth areas but I don't enjoy the flight to the East Coast. 

While I appreciate my NRA certs, even the NRALE certs, I do consider them to be very basic, but solid in foundation and of course the name recognition and backing is a definite positive and I do like breaking down fundamentals, but I have a much different approach in teaching them than the NRA or most trainers for that matter.  On the other hand I do not take the Simple Is Good approach either.  I guess that I am more along the hard line learning of fundamentals in regards to marksmanship and with base manipulations and functions of shooting that should become ingrained at the unconscious competence level of performance, or higher. 

Having said that SIG does have merit in regards to goal oriented and performance based shooting.  My goals and those I tend to work with are not merely content with recreation, but are rather performance based.  The laid back "stand how you want, float the dot and shoot the shot without moving the muzzle" doesn't fit in my instances and SIG understands this also.  They will deal with higher performance based shooters a good bit different, then someone just getting into shooting and that is not a bad thing by any means.  On the downside it is much harder to deal with a shooter who is trained in a "laid back" manner and then wants to get serious.  As you know deprogramming bad habits is often harder than dealing with a clean slate.  If at all possible, time and resources being available and shooter willing, I prefer to take a more correct approach from the very start.     

I look forward to following your progress! 
« Last Edit: February 23, 2017, 08:51:46 PM by Surf »

drck1000

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2017, 07:08:53 AM »
That looks like a pretty full training plan.  I had wanted to get back into attending mainland firearms courses, but had been bogged down with time and finance issues.  Now that those are much better, I have family issues keeping me occupied.  I can sort of live vicariously through your updates. 

Have you considered attending other training courses such as Front Sight, NRA and Sig?  Not that those aren't good/great training, just wondering about adding more diversity as you mentioned wanting to teach and coach tactical pistol training.  I haven't been to the Sig Academy, but have taken some courses with Sig instructors.  I've also going through NRA courses as well as have gotten NRA certified as well.  All have their strengths and I would say "less than strengths", but to me all are great for improving skill as well as being able to teach those skills.  I have been lucky to have had exposure to some excellent professional firearms training on the mainland and to a certain extent here.  The options locally are limited, but seems like the opportunities are looking better. 

I enjoy your updates and will be looking forward to how things go.  Particularly the equipment you use, how they perform and anything setup wise that you learn along the way through use in training that you may not have experienced through stuff like bullseye target range work.   :thumbsup:

zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2017, 02:14:00 AM »
This is my setup for practice and used when I attend classes.  I'm more of a generalist (jack of all trades) so I don't have anything fancy..  It's not going to win any competitions, but it's realistic and I do well with it.   I also keep it simple so that other people know you don't need to spend a lot of money on equipment and instead spend on ammunition and training.



A.  Ruger 10/22 w/bushnell scope and volquartsen hammer and springs.-  Good for cheap practice on fundamentals and shooting from different positions.  I upgraded the trigger due to the stock springs are really bad.
B.  Mixed AR15, milspec parts.  Aimpoint CompM2 sight, ARMS BUIS, Streamlight TLRS-1 flashlight - I keep it close to milspec to help coach military members.  The trigger is mushy but good enough.  I prefer the red dot versus magnified optics as it's faster to use from 1 to 50 yards.  The 4MOA dot is larger than I'd prefer and my astigmatism messes with it, but I can still get good hits to 200 yards.  My BUIS is zeroed to 25/300.  I use a blue force gear 2 point sling.  I found 2 points are the best overall.  3 points are too cumbersome and 1 points are great for training on the range, but you can't run around hands free.
C.  CMMG 22lr conversion bolt - I use this to save money on practice ammo.  I get about 4MOA groups from this.  I practice my rifle drills like getting into different positions, from the readies, multiple targets, transition to pistol, etc.
D.  Nylon gun belt and Bladetech holsters and pouches - got em with my Front Sight credits and works well enough and is comfortable.  Extra mags go in the pants pocket.  I figure realistically this is what I would use in real life and if I need more than 90 rounds of 5.56, then the world is probably really screwed up.  I don't think I've ever had to use more than 3 magazines for any class exercise.  I got tired of wearing a vest and plates at work, maybe I'll get a set in the future for the zombie apocalypse or WWIII.  I might get a Safariland Lvl III holster to practice with.
E.  SIRT Pistol & AR15 Bolt - I use these for dry fire practice alone or with the LaserApp training program.  Very good thing to have at home.  FYI, the laser is for a coach or training system to see, not for the shooter to see.  I see a lot of people using SIRT pistols the wrong way.
F.  Pocket Pro Shot Timer - I use this for dry and live fire practice to induce shooting under stress and improving my shot times.  Also to improve my shooting...float the dot shoot the shot.  I also have a shot timer loaded on my cell phone which I'll use an audio cable to plug into my electric ear muffs so I can practice at the range and not bother other people.
G.  Snap Caps/Dummy Rounds - I'll practice malfunction/reload drills.  Also use them during live fire to work on my trigger squeeze and flinch.  If I'm by myself, I'll randomly load dummy/live rounds in 3 magazines, mix the magazines up, shoot 2 mags and unload 1 which tries to keep it random.
H.  Advantage Arms 22lr conversion slide - Just like the AR15 kit, I use this to save money on handgun training.
I.  Glock 22 Gen 2 - My first handgun I got so it has sentimental value.  I use it for my classes and matches.  I shot around 20,000 rounds out of it and it still works great.
J.  Browning Buckmark 22lr - I use this to save money on practice ammo.   Usually I'll shoot a service pistol for my first set of cold shots to see how I do cold.  Then I'll go to 22lr, then back to service pistol for practice.
K  Revision Sawfly & Sport Ears - I used the Sawfly in the Army and they fit my face well.  I buy military surplus kits on ebay pretty cheap.  The one thing I really splurged on was the Sport Ears electronic earplugs which cost $1,000 for a set as my hearing is important.  These work great and are comfortable for all day use, easy to use, can hear commands and smack talk across the range, great for shooting rifles, can be used with helmets, and I don't get the sweaty ears from ear muffs.  I also use them at loud events.  Probably the best piece of equipment I've bought.

RSN172

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2017, 06:42:24 AM »
I wanted to get a set of Sport Ears, but since I'm retired and on a fixed income, it was a bit pricey for me.  Of the 20k rounds you fired on the Glock, can you recall how many, if any, malfunctions you had?  I have only fired 3000 or so through my Glock 19, but have not had a single malfunction yet.  I have a friend in MS who always caries 2 handguns whenever he leaves home just in case one malfunctions.
Happily living in Puna

Jl808

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2017, 07:33:28 AM »
Zippz, does the (c) CMMG 22LR conversion bolt require you to use specific type of 22LR ammo?  Does it foul up your barrel?  Do you need to do any specific kind of cleaning after shooting 22LR rounds on your AR?
I think, therefore I am armed.
NRA Life Patron member, HRA Life member, HiFiCo Life Member, HDF member

The United States Constitution © 1791. All Rights Reserved.

zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2017, 11:41:19 AM »
Zippz, does the (c) CMMG 22LR conversion bolt require you to use specific type of 22LR ammo?  Does it foul up your barrel?  Do you need to do any specific kind of cleaning after shooting 22LR rounds on your AR?

I used it with different types of high vel ammo and they all worked and it's more reliable than my Ruger 10/22.  Haven't had trouble with fouling maybe due to the chromed line barrel, people recommend shooting a few 5.56 rounds once in a while to clear out the barrel and gas system.  There is more residue inside the receiver but the bolt itself is all chrome so it's a simple wipe down with oil.  It fired somewhere between 750 to 1,000 rounds of 22lr without cleaning or oil before it started jamming.

zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2017, 11:55:48 AM »
I wanted to get a set of Sport Ears, but since I'm retired and on a fixed income, it was a bit pricey for me.  Of the 20k rounds you fired on the Glock, can you recall how many, if any, malfunctions you had?  I have only fired 3000 or so through my Glock 19, but have not had a single malfunction yet.  I have a friend in MS who always caries 2 handguns whenever he leaves home just in case one malfunctions.

If you have hearing problems, you could check with your health insurance for coverage.  It's basically a hearing aid that blocks sound.  Or get a tax deduction if you work in a noisy environment.

I've had very few malfunctions with the Glock with factory ammo to the point where I don't remember them except I remember having a Type 3 at Front Sight once.  I shoot reloaded plated bullets occasionally to save money on 40S&W ammo and they shoot well.

When I go to training classes, I bring a backup gun if the site has no rentals available.  I learned my lesson after I went to a HDF rifle class and I forgot to install the buffer after I cleaned it the previous night.  I got lazy and didn't do a functions check.

zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2017, 12:20:01 PM »
That looks like a pretty full training plan.  I had wanted to get back into attending mainland firearms courses, but had been bogged down with time and finance issues.  Now that those are much better, I have family issues keeping me occupied.  I can sort of live vicariously through your updates. 

Have you considered attending other training courses such as Front Sight, NRA and Sig?  Not that those aren't good/great training, just wondering about adding more diversity as you mentioned wanting to teach and coach tactical pistol training.  I haven't been to the Sig Academy, but have taken some courses with Sig instructors.  I've also going through NRA courses as well as have gotten NRA certified as well.  All have their strengths and I would say "less than strengths", but to me all are great for improving skill as well as being able to teach those skills.  I have been lucky to have had exposure to some excellent professional firearms training on the mainland and to a certain extent here.  The options locally are limited, but seems like the opportunities are looking better. 

I enjoy your updates and will be looking forward to how things go.  Particularly the equipment you use, how they perform and anything setup wise that you learn along the way through use in training that you may not have experienced through stuff like bullseye target range work.   :thumbsup:

I'm fortunate as I'm "between jobs" and saved up a lot of money so I'm using this time to get all my certs and learning more about the firearms community.  I like to post things like this to get people interested in what's out there and how they can do it.  Although firearms training in Hawaii is limited, there are a lot of classes and activities you can do here.  There's a lot more opportunities on the mainland that people don't consider or know about.

I've gone to Front Sight many times to DG Handgun, Rifle, and Shotgun basic courses, and did a couple of night classes, Adv Tac Handgun and 1 day Uzi (was free when FS first opened).  I think that FS is the Walmart of shooting schools where it's good, but not the best, but is cheap and appeals to the mass market.  I go there the most since the classes, airfare, lodging, rental cars, and food are cheap.  It's also next to Vegas and California.  I've done a bunch of NRA civilian instructor courses and plan to do a few other Sig classes while I'm there.  I'll try and finish up the FS curriculum in long gun tactics, Uzi, 4 gun, and precision rifle.  Then look into other shooting schools like Gunsite for the future. 

drck1000

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2017, 12:49:07 PM »
I'm fortunate as I'm "between jobs" and saved up a lot of money so I'm using this time to get all my certs and learning more about the firearms community.  I like to post things like this to get people interested in what's out there and how they can do it.  Although firearms training in Hawaii is limited, there are a lot of classes and activities you can do here.  There's a lot more opportunities on the mainland that people don't consider or know about.

I've gone to Front Sight many times to DG Handgun, Rifle, and Shotgun basic courses, and did a couple of night classes, Adv Tac Handgun and 1 day Uzi (was free when FS first opened).  I think that FS is the Walmart of shooting schools where it's good, but not the best, but is cheap and appeals to the mass market.  I go there the most since the classes, airfare, lodging, rental cars, and food are cheap.  It's also next to Vegas and California.  I've done a bunch of NRA civilian instructor courses and plan to do a few other Sig classes while I'm there.  I'll try and finish up the FS curriculum in long gun tactics, Uzi, 4 gun, and precision rifle.  Then look into other shooting schools like Gunsite for the future.
I meant have you considered course "other than" FS, Sig, NRA.  Now that I read what I wrote, I misspoke.  I recall that you have gone to many of those three schools/courses and your previous reports, which I enjoyed reading. 

While the cost can be up there, I've gone to a few courses with RedBack One.  Others that I've considered were Northern Red, Defoor, Vickers/Hackathorn, etc.  I've tried to get RedBack One here, but the range that I was trying to get fell through.  I'm hopeful that there will be more opportunity to have more courses along those lines offered here, but mostly in the "will see" and "eventually" modes right now.  That said, I always look forward to hearing about people investing their time in training.  It's been a while for me since I've been to one, so it's definitely been something that I've been very much wanting to get back into. 

FS is definitely a known name/commodity.  A bunch of shooting friends have been there and some even have the lifetime thing and have offered many times to take me.  I have yet to experience FS for myself, but if I was going to take a trip to the mainland for training, they wouldn't be my first option.  Not saying anything bad about their courses as I really don't know.  Just have always been interested in other trainers. 



zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2017, 12:50:37 PM »
Review of my past week's training.

Thursday - Shot at the KHSC bullseye pistol range.  My shooting was terrible as I couldn't keep my shots on a sheet of paper.  Could be bad habits I picked up when I shot with the MPPL the previous weekend (that was fun ) or possibly bad reloads?  It's been a long time since I flinched bullets into the 25 yard berm.

Saturday - I went to the HDF open shoot and started out by smashing my trigger finger with a mallet while setting up the tent.  I have to practice safe mallet awareness.  I started off my practice sessions shooting cold with my Glock and AR15 then switch to 22lr to save money, then switch back to 40S&W and 5.56.  I practiced holster presentations (working on my speed), one handed shooting, barricade, dropping into position, multiple targets, and rifle to pistol transitions while practicing emer/tac reloads all the way through.  I found that I shoot to the left with a crushed trigger finger.

Sunday - I volunteered and coached at the LIFE fun shoot.  I  helped a group of 4 guys shoot handgun and rifle for the first time.  Daniel from KGS led the rifle training which was basics in bounding and shoot on the move.  I know a lot of people don't like Daniel to include myself in the past, but I found that he's a good and very passionate guy.  He does a lot of volunteer work and has many well thought out ideas.

zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2017, 01:04:48 PM »
FS is definitely a known name/commodity.  A bunch of shooting friends have been there and some even have the lifetime thing and have offered many times to take me.  I have yet to experience FS for myself, but if I was going to take a trip to the mainland for training, they wouldn't be my first option.  Not saying anything bad about their courses as I really don't know.  Just have always been interested in other trainers.

If you've been to other advanced schools already and don't go to Las Vegas, then I wouldn't recommend FS unless you want to go with a group of friends and family.

drck1000

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2017, 01:33:06 PM »
If you've been to other advanced schools already and don't go to Las Vegas, then I wouldn't recommend FS unless you want to go with a group of friends and family.
I to go Vegas maybe 1-2 times a year, but usually with family that doesn't shoot. 

RSN172

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2017, 03:47:42 PM »
I always end up going to FS by myself.  There are always orher guys or even gals that don't have a shooting partner that you can partner up with.  The classes are usually made in even numbers so everyone has a partner.  I only go to FS because my grandkids live in Vegas and FS is the only one I can afford.  I think it is a decent school but not for the really advanced students.
Happily living in Puna

zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #16 on: April 17, 2017, 03:24:18 AM »
I haven't been practicing as much as I'd like, especially dry fire.  I've been doing about 2 live fire sessions per week and dry firing once a week at home.  I shot at the HDF open shoot practicing from the holster and rifle transitions.  Also did a couple of LIFE fun shoots.  Lately I've been preparing for my first Chinese Gun Club CMP match next weekend.  Shooting one handed really forces you to focus on your trigger squeeze which translates into better trigger control with 2 handed shooting.  I should be able to at least get all my shots on paper at 25 yards.  Hopefully I hit something at 50 yards.

I almost goofed on the SSA course registrations.  The Master Pistol was sold out and there is no waiting list.  I checked it everyday and a slot opened up.  So I got that and Master Rifle coming up.  I might take an Active Shooter response class too.  I'm just bringing my handgun, a Glock 22, and I'll borrow a MCX rifle from the school since I'll be visiting San Francisco on the way.

For this trip I'm taking a military hop to San Francisco, then fly to Georgia for the NRA annual meeting and get some range time in if I can, then up to New Hampshire for class.

zippz

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2017, 05:11:18 PM »
I did okay at my first Chinese Gun Club CMP match today.  Shot my stock Beretta 92F for a score of 130.  First stage was 10 shots in 10 minutes at 50 yards one handed.  I pushed my shots to the left so I had 7 shots spread out on the left half of the target and 3 were off target.  I guess I should invest in a small spotting scope for things like this.  Second stage were 2 strings of 5 shots in 20 seconds at 25 yards one handed.  I shot a bit too fast for the first string with a wide pattern on the target, second string I took my time and tightened the group.  Third stage was 2 strings of 5 shots in 10 seconds at 25 yards one handed.  I'll just say I have to work on that some more.

I don't feel I'm up to the level I should be at and I was too lazy to train more.  But I'm confident I'll pass my Sig master courses.  I'm leaving tonight on my 2 week trek. stopping by San Francisco (any protests going on this week?), Atlanta for the NRA conference, New Hampshire for Sig, and Colorado.

ren

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2017, 07:49:33 PM »
I did okay at my first Chinese Gun Club CMP match today.  Shot my stock Beretta 92F for a score of 130.  First stage was 10 shots in 10 minutes at 50 yards one handed.  I pushed my shots to the left so I had 7 shots spread out on the left half of the target and 3 were off target.  I guess I should invest in a small spotting scope for things like this.  Second stage were 2 strings of 5 shots in 20 seconds at 25 yards one handed.  I shot a bit too fast for the first string with a wide pattern on the target, second string I took my time and tightened the group.  Third stage was 2 strings of 5 shots in 10 seconds at 25 yards one handed.  I'll just say I have to work on that some more.

I don't feel I'm up to the level I should be at and I was too lazy to train more.  But I'm confident I'll pass my Sig master courses.  I'm leaving tonight on my 2 week trek. stopping by San Francisco (any protests going on this week?), Atlanta for the NRA conference, New Hampshire for Sig, and Colorado.

Bullseye pistol shooting and highpower rifle are different disciplines than what you'd encounter in your combat / self defense courses. I suggest getting the esoteric highpower and bullseye equipment. It would be difficult to shoot with others who are sporting shooting jackets, handloads, slings, and match tuned .45s. Try picking up a "NM" tuned Beretta 92 and compare that to a  "NM" .45.
That's my observations of the years I've seen you come out to HP and EIC shoots. I have never saw you shoot with a sling as the rest of the HP shooters do. It makes a big difference. :thumbsup:
Deeds Not Words

RSN172

Re: Prelude to SSS #2
« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2017, 08:51:12 PM »
Do you have to be one Pake for shoot at the Chinese Gun Club or is it open to anyone?
Happily living in Puna