Trump gave the middle finger to Russia (Read 10169 times)

troy tanaka

Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« on: April 06, 2017, 09:43:03 PM »
Finally a president that has the guts to bring the fight to Syria!!!. North Korea is next.

dafrtknocker

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2017, 09:48:54 PM »
He got tired of them crossing Obama's RED Line!

rklapp

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2017, 11:54:18 PM »
I guess we finally get to see this infamous prostitute peeing video that Russia has been using to blackmail Trump.
Yahh! Freedom and justice shall always prevail over tyranny, Babysitter Girl!
https://ronsreloading.wordpress.com/

dafrtknocker

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2017, 05:41:31 PM »
Good timing!

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2017, 06:04:04 PM »
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2017, 11:29:27 PM »
Did he give the middle finger to the Constitution as well?

I think this is something that should have gone through Congress. Too many wars without a declaration of war.

And unless I missed it, it would have been good to go through the UN as well.


Disclaimer: I don't disagree with a military, just the way it was carried out. The number of.missles seemed a little excessive as well. Those things aren't cheap.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2017, 11:40:41 PM »
Did he give the middle finger to the Constitution as well?

I think this is something that should have gone through Congress. Too many wars without a declaration of war.

And unless I missed it, it would have been good to go through the UN as well.

You're wrong.

War powers act only applies to use of force that may create an extended engagement.  Judicious, limited use of force with a specific scope is well within the power of the Commander in Chief.

Add to that the illegal leaks that have been trying to undermine the administration since before he was sworn in, and he has even more justification for not wasting time.  Quick, decisive action meant less chance of any leaks.

UN is not needed, either. 

Before the attack, Trump notified the Russians, and avoided hitting targets where Russian assets were parked at the air field.

All in all, the strike was immediate, decisive, well executed, and supported by a long list of countries' leaders.

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2017, 01:36:08 AM »
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2017, 08:25:37 PM »
You're wrong.

War powers act only applies to use of force that may create an extended engagement.  Judicious, limited use of force with a specific scope is well within the power of the Commander in Chief.

Add to that the illegal leaks that have been trying to undermine the administration since before he was sworn in, and he has even more justification for not wasting time.  Quick, decisive action meant less chance of any leaks.

UN is not needed, either. 

Before the attack, Trump notified the Russians, and avoided hitting targets where Russian assets were parked at the air field.

All in all, the strike was immediate, decisive, well executed, and supported by a long list of countries' leaders.

Funny that you have many opinions on cops but suggest a civilian can't have an opinion on the military?


I realize the president can use military force in some situations without the approval of congress declaring war. However I do think it is something that could have been brought to congress prior to acting. The UN would be nice though maybe a little too slow. But too often we have attacked foreign nations using the military with no declaration of war, even when time allowed. Trump is not the first person to do this but he is continuing what has been done many times before.

You are misapplying the war powers resolution though.
"It provides that the U.S. President can send U.S. Armed Forces into action abroad only by declaration of war by Congress, "statutory authorization," or in case of "a national emergency created by attack upon the United States, its territories or possessions, or its armed forces."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Powers_Resolution

From the same source:
Senator Rand Paul stated that the "the United States was not attacked" and that the "President needs Congressional authorization for military action as required by the Constitution."[28] Constitutional scholar and law professor Stephen Vladeck has noted that the strike potentially violates the War Powers Resolution. [29]

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2017, 08:31:19 PM »
Funny that you have many opinions on cops but suggest a civilian can't have an opinion on the military?


Look who's lecturing on opinions!!    :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You have an opinion on everything !!       :shake: :shake: :shake:

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2017, 08:33:33 PM »
Look who's lecturing on opinions!!    :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You have an opinion on everything !!       :shake: :shake: :shake:

Of course. So do you and most everyone who types here. You think we all sit and type in the political section to merely state non opinion things?

Thanks for point that out captain obvious. Wow, just wow.

By the way, it is duly noted that you left out any rebuttal about the constitutionality of Trump's actions and instead tried to make fun of me. Smooth diversion there.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2017, 08:54:36 PM »
Funny that you have many opinions on cops but suggest a civilian can't have an opinion on the military?


I realize the president can use military force in some situations without the approval of congress declaring war.
The US hasn't declared war since WWII, ever since the UN declared "war" to be illegal among member states.  Based on your analysis, Congress would only be needed to approve hostilities upon a declaration of war.  That's wrong. 

Quote
The War Powers Resolution requires the President to notify Congress within 48 hours of committing armed forces to military action and forbids armed forces from remaining for more than 60 days, with a further 30-day withdrawal period, without a Congressional authorization for use of military force  (AUMF) or a declaration of war by the United States. The resolution was passed by two-thirds of Congress, overriding a presidential veto.

A declaration of war is one option in the war powers resolution.  The other is AUMF, which is ALL the US has done since WWII -- no declaration of war will be coming out of Congress as long as we are a member of the UN.
[/b]

However I do think it is something that could have been brought to congress prior to acting. The UN would be nice though maybe a little too slow. But too often we have attacked foreign nations using the military with no declaration of war, even when time allowed. Trump is not the first person to do this but he is continuing what has been done many times before.

You are misapplying the war powers resolution though.
"It provides that the U.S. President can send U.S. Armed Forces into action abroad only by declaration of war by Congress, "statutory authorization," or in case of "a national emergency created by attack upon the United States, its territories or possessions, or its armed forces."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Powers_Resolution
Why did you stop copying and pasting before the paragraph I posted above from the same article?  See above as to why the President only has a requirement to NOTIFY Congress within 48 hours of committing forces.  He only requires authorization if the duration or scope fall into the above limits.

From the same source:
Senator Rand Paul stated that the "the United States was not attacked" and that the "President needs Congressional authorization for military action as required by the Constitution."[28] Constitutional scholar and law professor Stephen Vladeck has noted that the strike potentially violates the War Powers Resolution. [29]

Precedent allows what Trump did. 

Quote
On January 16, 2014, Senators John McCain and Tim Kaine unveiled legislation that would repeal the existing War Powers Resolution and replace it with a new law for greater presidential consultation to Congress before committing military forces to a war or armed conflict. Senator McCain justifies the effort by pointing out that Congress has not formally declared war since June 1942 and that the nature of war has changed since then. Senator Kaine said that modern threats require a re-examination of consultation between a president and the legislature.

There would be no need for a new law if the existing law meshed with the UN charter and our definitions of what constitutes "war".
[/b]
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2017, 08:55:36 PM »
Of course. So do you and most everyone who types here. You think we all sit and type in the political section to merely state non opinion things?

Thanks for point that out captain obvious. Wow, just wow.

By the way, it is duly noted that you left out any rebuttal about the constitutionality of Trump's actions and instead tried to make fun of me. Smooth diversion there.

Hey, Mr. EEF.  Try acting like an adult and give someone time to reply to your drivel.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

whynow?

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2017, 09:25:14 PM »
While I said right on to the quick response, kinda concerned about the type of people (Schumer, Nancy Piluti, and some MSM) that are praising Trump.  The political landscape is so complex now and when Trump's enemies start praising him, you gotta watch out.   They have one hand extended to praise and the other hand behind their back holding a knife.  These people and the Obama fanatics are dangerous vipers who infest our society.
All I know is that the American people's  enemies are islamic terrorists, Iran, Russia, Red China, No. Korea, the U.N. , those Americans who are trying to oust our current POTUS and most of the MSM.   This is a real mixed bag that we the people have to keep an eye on.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2017, 09:36:04 PM »
While I said right on to the quick response, kinda concerned about the type of people (Schumer, Nancy Piluti, and some MSM) that are praising Trump.  The political landscape is so complex now and when Trump's enemies start praising him, you gotta watch out.   They have one hand extended to praise and the other hand behind their back holding a knife.  These people and the Obama fanatics are dangerous vipers who infest our society.
All I know is that the American people's  enemies are islamic terrorists, Iran, Russia, Red China, No. Korea, the U.N. , those Americans who are trying to oust our current POTUS and most of the MSM.   This is a real mixed bag that we the people have to keep an eye on.

My way of looking at it is, how will we ever have a functioning government if we only do things the other side hates? 

Doing what's right doesn't require that your enemies oppose it.

It might be reason to carefully evaluate why they are applauding, but paranoia isn't going to help.  They may be simply praising him because Hillary just mentioned striking Syria's air fields not 2 hours before the attack.  Criticizing the move would mean opposing Hillary (and we all know that's never a good career move for Democrats!).
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Kuleana

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2017, 11:14:03 AM »
While I said right on to the quick response, kinda concerned about the type of people (Schumer, Nancy Piluti, and some MSM) that are praising Trump.  The political landscape is so complex now and when Trump's enemies start praising him, you gotta watch out.

You know you did the wrong thing when those who want to impeach you are praising you for the recent internationally illegal bombing action you've taken.


They have one hand extended to praise and the other hand behind their back holding a knife.

Not a knife, try a sniper rifle with a bullet with his name on it.


These people and the Obama fanatics are dangerous vipers who infest our society.

Don't forget that there are also Republicans on that list as well.


All I know is that the American people's  enemies are islamic terrorists, Iran, Russia, Red China, No. Korea, the U.N. , those Americans who are trying to oust our current POTUS and most of the MSM.

Except for the US created and armed ISIS, DPRK, the UN, domestic subverts, and the MSM; Iran, Russia, and China are competitors with America in the global economy, but are not enemies of the American people.  Those three nations face a reality of being surrounded by US military bases and constantly intimidated by US Naval assets.


This is a real mixed bag that we the people have to keep an eye on.

I agree.


Kuleana
« Last Edit: April 09, 2017, 01:01:46 PM by Kuleana »

FBI

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2017, 03:26:32 PM »
If you are going to start a war
Congress needs to pass a law.
This was a very expensive way
to get a point across.
Russian air defense S400 failed.
We can go and do whatever even
as badly atrophied as our military
presently is.
Lets all place nice.
Trump authorized the attack
while playing host.
Read Machiavelli and
Sun Tzu, you will get the i
idea. :geekdanc: :geekdanc: :geekdanc:

eyeeatingfish

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2017, 04:26:48 PM »
Hey, Mr. EEF.  Try acting like an adult and give someone time to reply to your drivel.

I replied after you posted, I didn't know you were going back to edit.

I think precedent is not a good argument in this case. Yes is has legal grounds but I don't think it is a good thing. I don't think he had to do it that soon. He could have ran it by congress first, even if he doesn't have to.

This was not an attack on the united states, its citizens, its military or even its allies.   That is what sets it apart from a normal action that is in response to aggression against us. Therein lies the violation of the War Powers Resolution. Is this what the founding fathers imagined? Does this not leave blood on our hands?

What type of precedent does this set? Are we going to send a cruise missile overtime a dictator kills a handful of his own people? Compare this to Somalia which as group effort with a strategy. We may have to agree to disagree though.

dafrtknocker

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #18 on: April 09, 2017, 05:31:56 PM »
You want approval from this U.N.

Russia, China block U.N. sanctions on Syria over gas attacks.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-chemicalweapons-idUSKBN167232

RSN172

Re: Trump gave the middle finger to Russia
« Reply #19 on: April 09, 2017, 05:56:20 PM »
No country will start a war with China, Russia or the US, including those 3 countries with each other.  They all have too much fire power.
Happily living in Puna