The hurricane scenario seems more applicable to a survival situation since it would affect everyone and not just the coastal areas.  In such a situation I would:

- Whip out my battery powered radio
- Fill up the bathtub with water (for washing, cooking and if need be, drinking)
- Tape up the windows in the event that they get broken they don't send shards of glass everywhere

I like Tom's idea of cooking rice in advance too.  I have enough meat, vegetable and even fruit canned goods but getting starch and carbohydrates might become a problem over an extended period. 

In addition to my hand-crank flashlight, I've been thinking an upgrade to a hand-crank radio might be in order so batteries get ruled out of the equation entirely. 

Somebody posted this on FH.  I've gotten through about 1/4 of it but it's been pretty interesting reading so far.  His lists are very comprehensive: http://www.theplacewithnoname.com/blogs/klessons/index.html

Thanks Antithesis. The page on documents was really good.

jeez, I dont think our state is prepared to handle a katrina type sit. we have nowhere to evac, there would prob. be massive amounts of homeless, I think a direct hurricane hit would completely disable our state for quite a while. Some of my guard friends who responded to Iniki on Kaua'i, say the same. I cant even imagine how we would prepare for that, I guess we better start investing in 55gal. drums of water and diesel.

Well we already have massive amounts of homeless and tent communities living in Hawaii.   

It doesn't help that the politicians are looking to raid the rainy day fund to fix various other shortfalls in the budget.  If that happens and a natural disaster hits, we are screwed. 

Somebody posted this on FH.  I've gotten through about 1/4 of it but it's been pretty interesting reading so far.  His lists are very comprehensive: http://www.theplacewithnoname.com/blogs/klessons/index.html

Excellent link!  Thanks.

jeez, I dont think our state is prepared to handle a katrina type sit. we have nowhere to evac, there would prob. be massive amounts of homeless, I think a direct hurricane hit would completely disable our state for quite a while. Some of my guard friends who responded to Iniki on Kaua'i, say the same. I cant even imagine how we would prepare for that, I guess we better start investing in 55gal. drums of water and diesel.

i think the major difference in what happened in New Orleans, was that the levees broke, compounding the problem of the hurricane.  We should, nevertheless, take notes and learn from their experience.

I was also fortunate to not be living here during Iniki.  As shown by the actions of Civil Defense this past tsunami warning, I think the government, in terms of preparations, will be well equipped.  My only stories are from family and friends who live on Oahu so I cannot confirm what went down on Kauai.  Oahu, for instance, had about 3 days without power, some areas a little longer.  Some roads were impassable due to downed wires/poles and trees.  There were no reports of loss of water pressure.  There are stories of neighbors helping neighbors.  The aloha spirit was alive and well.  (Little of which made the national news.) I'm curious to hear the stories you've heard from Kaua'i. 

If we take any lessons from the tsunami warning, it would be that water would become scarce if you didn't already have a stash, and that gas stations can and will run out of gas in just a few hours.

Just a note on 55gal drums for water.  5 gallon food grade buckets are practically free (or close to free) from food/restaurant places (just ask) and easier to transport if needed.  These are made from a specific type of plastic blend that doesn't leach chemicals into the water.  Get the ones with covers.

jeez, I dont think our state is prepared to handle a katrina type sit. we have nowhere to evac, there would prob. be massive amounts of homeless, I think a direct hurricane hit would completely disable our state for quite a while. Some of my guard friends who responded to Iniki on Kaua'i, say the same. I cant even imagine how we would prepare for that, I guess we better start investing in 55gal. drums of water and diesel.

As someone who responded to Iniki, who's team went to Katrina and Rita, and who was in the EOC for the duration of the Tsunami warning, I can tell you that Hawaii is relatively well prepared to deal with something like a direct hurricane. But, that being said, I think most folks have a an unrealistic expectation of what that response would/should be.

Regardless of how well prepared Hawaii (or any other State or governmental organization) one should be prepared to care for themselves and their families for a MINIMUM of 72 hours. If a major event were to strike, infrastructure would be compromised, meaning roads would be impassable and thus delivery of any relief supplies would be hampered/delayed until they could be cleared. EMS, fire and police would be similarily hampered. Airfields (such as the airport on Kauai after Iniki) would be fouled and support from unaffected islands would also be affected.

The bottom line is that even in the best responses it may be days before organized relief can reach most of the affected population. That's what you need to prepare for.

Quote from: tonsofguns on March 02, 2010, 09:58:23 PM

jeez, I dont think our state is prepared to handle a katrina type sit. we have nowhere to evac, there would prob. be massive amounts of homeless, I think a direct hurricane hit would completely disable our state for quite a while. Some of my guard friends who responded to Iniki on Kaua'i, say the same. I cant even imagine how we would prepare for that, I guess we better start investing in 55gal. drums of water and diesel.

As someone who responded to Iniki, who's team went to Katrina and Rita, and who was in the EOC for the duration of the Tsunami warning, I can tell you that Hawaii is relatively well prepared to deal with something like a direct hurricane. But, that being said, I think most folks have a an unrealistic expectation of what that response would/should be.

Regardless of how well prepared Hawaii (or any other State or governmental organization) one should be prepared to care for themselves and their families for a MINIMUM of 72 hours. If a major event were to strike, infrastructure would be compromised, meaning roads would be impassable and thus delivery of any relief supplies would be hampered/delayed until they could be cleared. EMS, fire and police would be similarily hampered. Airfields (such as the airport on Kauai after Iniki) would be fouled and support from unaffected islands would also be affected.

The bottom line is that even in the best responses it may be days before organized relief can reach most of the affected population. That's what you need to prepare for.

Thank you for your insight. 

Here's the Civil Defense webisite:  http://www.scd.state.hi.us/

.....In retrospect, a scanner would be nice.  Listening to the callers on KSSK was downright irritating.  Can't hurt to have more water either.....

You can never have too much water...most folks have no concept of the actual amount of water they use on a daily basis. And, a scanner is quickly becoming useless...most agencies are transitioning to the 800MHz intraoperable frequencies and those cannot be listened to via a simple scanner...a battery oerated radio/weather radio is a good idea though.

Quote from: Jaydawg on February 27, 2010, 03:34:42 PM

.....In retrospect, a scanner would be nice.  Listening to the callers on KSSK was downright irritating.  Can't hurt to have more water either.....

You can never have too much water...most folks have no concept of the actual amount of water they use on a daily basis. And, a scanner is quickly becoming useless...most agencies are transitioning to the 800MHz intraoperable frequencies and those cannot be listened to via a simple scanner...a battery oerated radio/weather radio is a good idea though.

Thanks HiCarry,

I knew they were switching over, but wasn't sure what the frequencies were.  Radioshack does have some scanners in that range, although most users have a hard time programming them.

I found a post written by a tourist/visitor in regards to the recent tsunami warning and his prep/evac in response.  ~A small bit about our concealed carry law.  ~Also a bit on what HiCarry touched on regarding what people expect for the state's emergency response.

Letter Re: Experiencing the Recent Hawaiian Tsunami Evacuation Alert

Jim,
I had the recent somewhat surreal experience of going through the Hawaiian costal evacuation during the most recent tsunami alert. It was a near-miss natural disaster scenario that unfolded in slow motion because of the distance from the Chilean earthquake and the presence of tsunami alert sensors and monitoring officials. There are a few observations that I'd like to share.

I managed to stay ahead of the Golden Horde phenomena by a few hours and it was interesting to just acknowledge some of the predictable elements: most people were not alerted to the risk of the tsunami until 0600 when the civil defense sirens went off. The gas stations and grocery stores were subsequently mobbed and quickly were depleted of supplies. For the most part people were civil with each other but there were some conflicts despite the local radio hosts admonitions to "remember people, love, love, love -- aloha". I think the conflicts were minimal because this was a "potential" disaster only. The costal highways of course were packed. Look at a map of Maui and you can see how egress from many of the more densely populated areas is limited to a single road (right on the coast).

The other folks who were up with me at 0200 beating the crowds tended to be folks with increased "situational awareness". For example, I talked with a guy that had worked for the powerplant and knew that it was in the inundation zone and was threatened. This also included the main airport and of course the harbors. He currently works for the public utility and also knew that water and sewage pumping stations would be: a) turned off in expectation of the tsunami surge and b) out of commission if the island took a big hit. In a place where everything has to be shipped from somewhere else, it didn't take much imagination to realize that 120,000 inhabitants and 60,000 tourists could be quickly SOL for services and supplies.

All of this was of course to be expected. Somewhat more subtle revelations include:

-Even if you are going to Hawaii for your 25th wedding anniversary a preparedness awareness and travel kit are in order

-Consider the potential threats in your travel destination. For example a hotel room could be selected not just for the view but with the knowledge that in a tsunami you can vertically evacuate to above the 3rd floor, trying to balance with concerns for fire, or earthquake (these are volcanic islands of course and while there we also got to experience the Vog - volcanic smog, coming from the big island).

-When we arrived we didn't "need" anything more than a compact car - but it turned out to be prudent to have rented a vehicle with extra cargo carrying capacity when suddenly I was packing cases of water and food and supplies for potential camp out for multiple days

-It reminded me that the being in a state that disallows for conceal carry and personal/ family defense is not just a quaint ideological or cultural shift, but has potential real implications

-I was lucky in that I was up late enough to get the earliest tsunami warning reports. If it weren't for the Olympic coverage on television (which I normally would not be watching), I too would had my first awareness of the situation at 0600 with the rest of the clueless. It taught me that in your travel environment, (or home for that matter) some kind of monitoring of news and or civil defense sources is a good idea.

| -One shouldn't rely on the hotel or your other hosts for timely prep or information -- they still had their maintenance folks sweeping sidewalks just off the beach as part of their tsunami prep.

-We had selected a hotel room outfitted with a kitchen and this really helped when it came to taking essentials for cooking and cleaning, (as well as self defense if you count a 10" chef's knife)

-Civil Defense plans and their orchestration with local agencies was pretty good - but: a) a lot of sirens that were supposed to did not go off, and there were "gathering points" for evacuees that had no supplies (food, water, etc) because this was not part of the plan. Obviously the civil defense planning has not yet included secure power and water supply systems either. Your travel situational awareness might also include taking in the strength and weakness of governmental agencies and infrastructure. This now goes on my travel checklist.

I feel very lucky to have been able to watch and learn from all of this without having had to experience a full blown catastrophe. The process is going to light a fire under my tail to get going with my preparedness plans and to give all of them some needed hard reflection.

This is straight from Dean Nakano, deputy chief engineer with the Honolulu Board of Water Supply:

In a power outage, the island would have no more than a 24-hour supply of water. “We do have the capability to move emergency generators to serve pumps, to temporarily maintain levels in the reservoirs,” Nakano explains. “But heaven forbid we should have an extended, island-wide blackout.”

from Honolulu Weekly Dec 23, 2009

http://honoluluweekly.com/story-continued/2009/12/its-the-water-2/

^Scary thought.  I've been doing a little internet research into how long bottled water actually "lasts".  Apparently the scientists have yet to determine if there is a shelf life for bottled water.  Asside from a slight change in flavor, there isn't really any way for the water to "degrade" and get you sick since it is sterilized and vaccum sealed.  All the more reason to stockpile another case or two. 

bottled water shelf life remains unclear
Shelf life of bottled water?
Does bottled drinking water go bad?

I really wonder if there is a 24-hour supply of water everywhere. If I'm not mistaken, some of the areas work off of gravity and don't need to rely on a pump. I can only remember the last power outage we had and I think it was more than 24 hours at my place, but we still had water.

Bottled water is great and if you worry about old water, just cycle it out like canned goods.

I really wonder if there is a 24-hour supply of water everywhere. If I'm not mistaken, some of the areas work off of gravity and don't need to rely on a pump. I can only remember the last power outage we had and I think it was more than 24 hours at my place, but we still had water.

Bottled water is great and if you worry about old water, just cycle it out like canned goods.

It's not exactly a 24 hour supply...it's what is in the elevated storage containers contain when the power stops and the consumption rate thereafter. All of the water pressure is generated by letting the stored water flow "downhill" to the tap in your home. Some highrise building have supplemental pumps, as do some hospitals, but essentially that's it. Water is pumped into the holding containers, generally at night when the power grid can more easily accomodate the demand, and that volume (which differes depending on holding tank capacity) is generally partially depleated during the day. At night the cycle repeats. As Nakano says, there are some generators that can be moved to push the water into the tanks, but the capacity to do that is far less than "normal" demands and an extended power outage would indeed result in limited water availability. To what extent and for how long would be dependent on the ability to power the generators that pump the water to the tanks.

And, to comment on storage options: earlier someone said 5 gallon buckets were a good resource, which they are. Another container that will work are the plastic 55 gallon drums. They can be had at Aloha Shoyu (I think that's the company...it's in Halawa valley). They will sell to the public the used 55 gallon drums for a very reasonable price....they will wash and clean them for you. I have used one for camping and it works very well...even pulled the bung on mine and installed a cheap plastic faucet. Worked like a champ while the drum was on it's side.

Ah....I see. Thanks for the great explanation and the source for drums.

You also have to take into account that the public will hoard water when they become aware of the imminent disaster.  Any public reserves in the water towers will be depeleted faster than if it were just a normal day without water. 

If just electricity were knocked out, I think I could survive several weeks if need be.
If electricity and water were knocked out (without any time to fill up buckets, bathtubs, or drums) as it stands now I only have enough water for a few days. 

I really wonder if there is a 24-hour supply of water everywhere. If I'm not mistaken, some of the areas work off of gravity and don't need to rely on a pump. I can only remember the last power outage we had and I think it was more than 24 hours at my place, but we still had water.

Bottled water is great and if you worry about old water, just cycle it out like canned goods.

I remember the last outage we had, i think it was last year when the branch hit the transformer or somethingy, and I dont remember a loss of water...of course that wasn't an island wide outage and it didnt last more than 24 hours. I, however, can pretty much guarantee that if the island of Oahu was in imminent danger of a katrina scale hurricane, either category 4 or 5 (cant remember offhand but i think it was 4), this island and the others would be in chaos before the storm even hits, maybe even a week before the storm hits. The State of Hawaii is NOT prepared, the stores dont have but a few days to a week worth of inventory, and the hardware stores definitely do not have enough plywood for all our windows. I shit you not, it took FEMA weeks to get their shit straight in the gulf coast, how long do you think it would take to get supplies for say 1 million people stranded 6,000 miles from D.C.?!

My point is this...a 72 hour kit is great if you live on the mainland, but out here in middle of the ocean your gonna need food, water, sanitation, shelter, and medical for at least 60 days.

Quote from: 2aHawaii on March 09, 2010, 01:44:38 PM

I really wonder if there is a 24-hour supply of water everywhere. If I'm not mistaken, some of the areas work off of gravity and don't need to rely on a pump. I can only remember the last power outage we had and I think it was more than 24 hours at my place, but we still had water.

Bottled water is great and if you worry about old water, just cycle it out like canned goods.

I remember the last outage we had, i think it was last year when the branch hit the transformer or somethingy, and I dont remember a loss of water...of course that wasn't an island wide outage and it didnt last more than 24 hours. I, however, can pretty much guarantee that if the island of Oahu was in imminent danger of a katrina scale hurricane, either category 4 or 5 (cant remember offhand but i think it was 4), this island and the others would be in chaos before the storm even hits, maybe even a week before the storm hits. The State of Hawaii is NOT prepared, the stores dont have but a few days to a week worth of inventory, and the hardware stores definitely do not have enough plywood for all our windows. I shit you not, it took FEMA weeks to get their shit straight in the gulf coast, how long do you think it would take to get supplies for say 1 million people stranded 6,000 miles from D.C.?!

My point is this...a 72 hour kit is great if you live on the mainland, but out here in middle of the ocean your gonna need food, water, sanitation, shelter, and medical for at least 60 days.

I respectfully disagree. Hawaii is well prepared to deal with a catastrophic event. It is the populace at large that are generally NOT prepared. Could Hawaii's preparations be better? I think most would agre that any system, including Hawaii's, could be improved. But, as I said, I think most folks misunderstand that despite the best possible preparations and contingency plans, they should NOT expect help from governmental agencies for a period of time after the causative event ends and response plans could be implemented. Generally speaking, the recommended time frame is 72 hours of self-sufficiency. If you can increase that time frame, all the better. I keep a minimum of 14 days emergency supplies on hand at any point in time. Sometimes, depending on rotation of stock or availability of certain supplies, that may be slighly less, but often is more.

The isolation from the mainland is not a factor in State wide response plans, with the possible exception of response personnel that might come to assist on-island assets.

You are correct in noting that most stores, especially grocery stores, replenish fresh foods on a 48-72 rotation. And that other durable supplies may be limited, but this is why you should plan for, and obtain the supplies you deem necessay well in advance of any known event. If you start your emergency preparations, especially the provisioning, after the threat of a major event is announced, there is a good chance you will not be able to get all the supplies you need.   

I just wanted to post a first impression about the 10-PACK BRINKMAN 6LED FLASHLIGHT on sale for $9.97 at Home Depot til 03/24/10.  When I first saw the ad, I thought wow, LED flashlights for a dollar each with free batteries those gotta sell out.  Nah, there was still a bunch left at the HD Pearl City location. 


Housing is made of plastic with a "no-slip grip" that feels like rubber, but I assume is plastic also (if that makes sense).  I am able to scratch it with pressure of my fingernail.  I haven't weighed it yet.  It's not hefty enough to be used as a palm stick/kubotan.  It uses and comes with 3 generic brand AAA batteries.  It has a push button switch in the rear which gives a positive click.  It only turns "on" and "off." No fancy strobe setting.  My 3 year old was able to manipulate the push button quite well.  I've tapped it on the table a couple of times and my son accidentally   dropped the flashlight on a tile floor with no ill effects. 

At almost 4" long and approx 1" diameter it fits nicely in the palm...not overly bulky.  It comes with a lanyard, but the section that ties directly to the flashlight is pretty thin.  Probably would be able to fit paracord through the attachment point.  I am able to fit my medium/large hand through the lanyard quite easily.   

Illumination is quite bright and brighter than my incandescent light and creates a headache after being flashed in the eyes multiple times by my 3 year old son (he likes to shine them on people).  Bright enough to disorient someone in the dark. 

There's a prominent warning label on the back "TO PREVENT DAMAGE TO EYESIGHT, NEVER LOOK INTO HEADLIGHT WHEN LIGHT IS ON.  DO NOT SHINE LIGHT INTO THE FACE OF SOMEONE ELSE."  Shucks...should've read that first. 
Now I have a flashlight for each of the vehicles, bug out bags, and 1st aid bags and I still have some more to spare.  At a $1 each, I don't have to worry about them being stolen out of vehicles.

(again disclaimer...I do not get paid by Home Depot or Brinkmann)