Thanks for not trying to prove me wrong.  Even you know it's impossible.

    

Still not falling for your trap. Give you an A for persistence though.

Still not falling for your trap. Give you an A for persistence though.

You should take up professional dodge ball.

You're a natural!    

You should take up professional dodge ball.

You're a natural!    

You never made any real point so I have nothing to prove you wrong on. Proven you wrong so many times before though, I guess you are afraid to say anything substantive anymore. 

What I think we should do is try to help find a solution instead of just attacking theirs otherwise we really aren't doing anything to address the issue and they are going to keep steamrolling over our rights. So here is the tough question, what do you think we should do instead of banning 80% lowers?

For what overall purpose?  To reduce deaths?  There is a list a mile long that causes more morbidity and mortality than firearms.   How about an 8 month wait to see a psychiatrist on the big island?  Screw you if you are suicidal, just dont use a gun to off yourself? There are so many more important issues to deal with and meanwhile we are focusing on 80% firearms.    This state is clueless.   

by the way, I tried to introduce a bill to limit what medical insurances can deny in this state (we are only 1 of 2 states with no laws on this).  You know what happened?  HMSA made it so they wont even introduce the bill.  so much for representation.  They pay their lobbyist $40,000 a month.  I cant even watch my bill get voted down.  We lost another 100 physicians last year because HMSA is a monopoly and gets to determine how physicians are paid and we are 49th for physician pay out of 50 states.   

I think something like that might be a tiny bigger problem than 80% receivers.  but we get 25 bills last season against guns.  Meanwhile healthcare in this state goes down the tubes.  F-it, we dont need doctors, just smear turmeric on it. 

Second hand smoke kills 4 as many people as gun murders. 43 times as many smokers.    priorities?

we should do exactly nothing with 80% receivers and spend the limited brain power in the state legislature on fixing perhaps one or two actual issues. 

You never made any real point so I have nothing to prove you wrong on. Proven you wrong so many times before though, I guess you are afraid to say anything substantive anymore. 

My POINT was that your POINT is bullcrap.

Learn to read.

no we shouldn't ban 80% lowers
most people arguing for another stupid knee jerk reaction ban on 80% lowers have NO CLUE about how to go about building one - they should stop talking out of their arses just to argue or further erode our 2A rights.

no we shouldn't ban 80% lowers
most people arguing for another stupid knee jerk reaction ban on 80% lowers have NO CLUE about how to go about building one - they should stop talking out of their arses just to argue or further erode our 2A rights.

The "point" EEF is promoting -- that an 80% lower makes it "easier" for criminals to acquire firearms and should be "confronted" -- ignores reality.

EVERY OTHER PART of a build, whether it's an AR, handgun, etc., is sold without restrictions.  For example, I can buy a 14" barrel with no background check or other qualifications/restrictions, and build a Short Barrel Rifle without an NFA stamp and in violation of Hawaii law.  Whether my lower receiver was acquired legally or not, buying a barrel that's < 16" makes it easier for me to break the law.

Hence, his entire argument is ridiculous.  Focusing on one component milled by the end user and sold without restrictions is ridiculous.  The term "ghost gun" is yet another politician-created term, just like "assault weapon", to make these guns sound scarier than they really are.

Maybe EEF should suggest a bill to his Hawaii rep to require buyers of 80% lowers fill out 80% of a firearm registration form?   

Like I said previously.

I’d bet 98% of “ghost guns” are made with a file or dremel by grinding serial numbers off of guns.
 NOT made from 80% receivers.
They’re too difficult to complete unless you know what you’re doing and have the machinery.

I don’t have any statistics. Not sure anyone does.

Like I said previously.

.
They’re too difficult to complete unless you know what you’re doing and have the machinery.

'Difficult' is relative. The only 'machinery' you need for an AR lower is a router and a drill (if you bought the jig kit with the end mills and drill bits). Even if you do a piss poor sloppy job they will still function. I have seen vids of people finishing pistol lowers with only a pair of snips and a file. They butchered it, but it fired just fine. If you have the patience and skill to steal and strip cars, finishing a lower aint no thing. Hawaii public school wood shop taught you enough to make it happen.

Hawaii public school wood shop taught you enough to make it happen.

Ooh! I’m qualified den! 

I thought about buying a P80 from HGS last weekend. Just because. Not really interested in building one, but because I can.

Rhetorical question.
Would a liquor store robber do all that machining with an 80% receiver? Is it worth it? They can use a replica airsoft gun or nerf gun to rob a liquor store or 7-11. Why? Because no one is armed in a liquor store here in Hawaii. We are always advised by our civic leaders to give up the money. A robber will get the money in the end.
If the liquor store owner is armed and shoots the robber he/she will always go to jail for at least a night. If LE did the shooting no one is going to jail that night. Not worth the trouble for your Hawaii liquor store owner.
So it's almost a guarantee that a robber would get money. They wouldn't need a gun not even a real firearm - just a threat

So when our bright, mindless leaders enact law to ban 80% receivers who will comply? That's right. It will NOT affect criminals at all.

Passing more laws to reign in recurring criminal behavior is asinine. Empower the sheeple citizens and turn them into fanged shepherds.

Rhetorical question.
Would a liquor store robber do all that machining with an 80% receiver? Is it worth it? They can use a replica airsoft gun or nerf gun to rob a liquor store or 7-11. Why? Because no one is armed in a liquor store here in Hawaii. We are always advised by our civic leaders to give up the money. A robber will get the money in the end.
If the liquor store owner is armed and shoots the robber he/she will always go to jail for at least a night. If LE did the shooting no one is going to jail that night. Not worth the trouble for your Hawaii liquor store owner.
So it's almost a guarantee that a robber would get money. They wouldn't need a gun not even a real firearm - just a threat

So when our bright, mindless leaders enact law to ban 80% receivers who will comply? That's right. It will NOT affect criminals at all.

Passing more laws to reign in recurring criminal behavior is asinine. Empower the sheeple citizens and turn them into fanged shepherds.

rein*   

Rhetorical question.
Would a liquor store robber do all that machining with an 80% receiver? Is it worth it? They can use a replica airsoft gun or nerf gun to rob a liquor store or 7-11. Why? Because no one is armed in a liquor store here in Hawaii. We are always advised by our civic leaders to give up the money. A robber will get the money in the end.
If the liquor store owner is armed and shoots the robber he/she will always go to jail for at least a night. If LE did the shooting no one is going to jail that night. Not worth the trouble for your Hawaii liquor store owner.
So it's almost a guarantee that a robber would get money. They wouldn't need a gun not even a real firearm - just a threat

So when our bright, mindless leaders enact law to ban 80% receivers who will comply? That's right. It will NOT affect criminals at all.

Passing more laws to reign in recurring criminal behavior is asinine. Empower the sheeple citizens and turn them into fanged shepherds.

Gun laws are not made for criminals or impact their crimes. Theyre made to disarm the people.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

For all this talk on 80%

p80 80% receiver on sale at midway.  $91 with shipping to Hawaii
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1020552143

Rest of the G17 parts $299 at MDX arms, they also ship to hawaii
https://mdxarms.com/mdx-arms-polymer80-pf940cl-build-kit-less-frame/

For all this talk on 80%

p80 80% receiver on sale at midway.  $91 with shipping to Hawaii
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1020552143

Rest of the G17 parts $299 at MDX arms, they also ship to hawaii
https://mdxarms.com/mdx-arms-polymer80-pf940cl-build-kit-less-frame/

So without shipping cost, $390 just for the parts. 

So this comes back to the story about would a felon pay $700 for a gun that's going to be tossed or $200?

My POINT was that your POINT is bullcrap.

Learn to read.

Yet you consistently fail to articulate any actual reason why. You just like to say things and insist they are right.

The "point" EEF is promoting -- that an 80% lower makes it "easier" for criminals to acquire firearms and should be "confronted" -- ignores reality.

So you are arguing that it is just as easy to mill a lower out of a plain block of aluminum as it is to finish an 80% lower... talk about ignoring reality.

For what overall purpose?  To reduce deaths?  There is a list a mile long that causes more morbidity and mortality than firearms.   How about an 8 month wait to see a psychiatrist on the big island?  Screw you if you are suicidal, just dont use a gun to off yourself? There are so many more important issues to deal with and meanwhile we are focusing on 80% firearms.    This state is clueless.   

by the way, I tried to introduce a bill to limit what medical insurances can deny in this state (we are only 1 of 2 states with no laws on this).  You know what happened?  HMSA made it so they wont even introduce the bill.  so much for representation.  They pay their lobbyist $40,000 a month.  I cant even watch my bill get voted down.  We lost another 100 physicians last year because HMSA is a monopoly and gets to determine how physicians are paid and we are 49th for physician pay out of 50 states.   

I think something like that might be a tiny bigger problem than 80% receivers.  but we get 25 bills last season against guns.  Meanwhile healthcare in this state goes down the tubes.  F-it, we dont need doctors, just smear turmeric on it. 

Second hand smoke kills 4 as many people as gun murders. 43 times as many smokers.    priorities?

we should do exactly nothing with 80% receivers and spend the limited brain power in the state legislature on fixing perhaps one or two actual issues.

For what overall purpose? To give legislators some other avenue to take instead of trying to take our firearms. And sure, if addressing the problem through an alternate means that doesn't result in us losing our rights saves lives then that is great too.

No argument against prioritizing all the other problems you mentioned though it isn't one or the other.

I totally understand the argument that criminals aren't going to follow the law either way but the truth is that not all criminals are the same or going to use firearms for the same purpose. The guy robbing a 7/11 probably isn't going to make an 80% when he can go get one off the black market. I think the issue where 80% lowers would come up are the first time criminals who want to shoot up a school. Those guys don't have the criminal experience or connection to know where to buy a black market gun and if the person has a mental health history in states such as ours where a background check could disqualify someone from a legal purchase they are going to have more difficulty locating a firearm. 80% lowers would seem to be the answer for these types of individuals. Now granted, I could be wrong, maybe active shooters will never make their own firearms at any statistically significant rate but 80% lowers are so new and relatively unknown outside of firearm enthusiasts that I don't think enough time has passed where we could have a reliable dataset on that question.

I know that if I decided to go on a shooting rampage and couldn't pass the HPD background check I would most likely resort to 80% lowers.

Every year they pass another stupid bill that further infringes on our rights yet accomplishes nothing as far as reducing crime. Why on earth would anyone in our position want to hand them concessions? Do you really think if we try to make them happy they will leave us alone? Honestly?

I know that if I decided to go on a shooting rampage and couldn't pass the HPD background check I would most likely resort to 80% lowers.

IF you decided ? 
Sounds like you are currently contemplating "to go on a shooting rampage". 
Perfect "Red Flag" candidate.