Email the Mayor - range re-opening (Read 28046 times)

aieahound

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #80 on: May 24, 2020, 12:32:28 PM »


BTW have you emailed, called, or written our elected officials to reopen the range like the rest of us?

Brystont1

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #81 on: May 24, 2020, 04:19:23 PM »
Stop jumping to conclusions. You think you can kill someone in self defense anywhere in this country and not end up facing financial stresses and other stresses? You are hearing what you want to hear.

Even if you are clearly innocent of any wrongdoing you still just went through a traumatic incident. Even if the cops have no case against you, the families of the decedent might still sue you (which costs money). You think the cleanup and repair of your home after you kill someone is gonna cost you nothing?

Again for the second time, that is NOT what Ballard is talking about. I understand that you like to play “devils advocate“ here so that you can appear to be the “sensible” one, but I think you’ve been playing it for so long that you actually are no longer “playing.”

Unless you didn’t know, this state is anti 2A. Go watch the debate with peter Carlisle and Hawaii rifle association and maybe it will give you some insight as to how this state wants you to act with respects to firearms and home defense. They don’t want you defending yourself or family with a firearm. They want you to call the police and wait, and when God forbid your wife or child is harmed or killed they will say “there was nothing we could do”.

So I’ll say it again, her statement about “financial and family toll” had NOTHING to do with a lawsuit from a family. NOTHING to do with “cleaning your house” (lol). It was a direct threat to us who would have the audacity to use a firearm in a home defense situation, period.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #82 on: May 24, 2020, 05:02:22 PM »
Stop jumping to conclusions. You think you can kill someone in self defense anywhere in this country and not end up facing financial stresses and other stresses? You are hearing what you want to hear.

Even if you are clearly innocent of any wrongdoing you still just went through a traumatic incident. Even if the cops have no case against you, the families of the decedent might still sue you (which costs money). You think the cleanup and repair of your home after you kill someone is gonna cost you nothing?

"Whether you're in the right or you're wrong, you're still going to have to go through
the legal system,
you're going to have to go through
all this [the legal system]," Ballard said.

"It's [the legal system is] going to be a toll on your family, 
it's [the legal system is] going to be a financial toll.

Is it [shooting someone in self defense] worth it [going through the legal system] ?"

Context:  Public news conference encouraging law makers to not pass "shall issue" Concealed Carry in the state (i.e. take away her power to deny this right).


Pronouns refer back to what was already mentioned in speech and writing, because there's no other meaning the listener/reader can assign to a pronoun.  Her comment is not ambiguous to anyone who understands plain English.

Show me where anything she said eludes to "other stresses," "a traumatic incident", "families of the decedent [may] still sue you" , "cleanup", or "repair".

You seem to have a real desire to interpret her words in the best possible light by bringing things into it that she never once mentioned. 

Time for your Performance Evaluation?
« Last Edit: May 24, 2020, 05:12:53 PM by Flapp_Jackson »
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #83 on: May 24, 2020, 09:12:00 PM »
Again for the second time, that is NOT what Ballard is talking about. I understand that you like to play “devils advocate“ here so that you can appear to be the “sensible” one, but I think you’ve been playing it for so long that you actually are no longer “playing.”

Not playing devi'ls advocate, only pointing out what she actually said. You can assume her motives all you want but you can't state them as if they were her words, that is just misinformation.

Quote
So I’ll say it again, her statement about “financial and family toll” had NOTHING to do with a lawsuit from a family. NOTHING to do with “cleaning your house” (lol). It was a direct threat to us who would have the audacity to use a firearm in a home defense situation, period.

If you want to jump to that conclusion I certainly can't stop you.

eyeeatingfish

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #84 on: May 24, 2020, 09:15:25 PM »
"Whether you're in the right or you're wrong, you're still going to have to go through
the legal system,
you're going to have to go through
all this [the legal system]," Ballard said.

"It's [the legal system is] going to be a toll on your family, 
it's [the legal system is] going to be a financial toll.

Is it [shooting someone in self defense] worth it [going through the legal system] ?"

Context:  Public news conference encouraging law makers to not pass "shall issue" Concealed Carry in the state (i.e. take away her power to deny this right).


Pronouns refer back to what was already mentioned in speech and writing, because there's no other meaning the listener/reader can assign to a pronoun.  Her comment is not ambiguous to anyone who understands plain English.

Show me where anything she said eludes to "other stresses," "a traumatic incident", "families of the decedent [may] still sue you" , "cleanup", or "repair".

You seem to have a real desire to interpret her words in the best possible light by bringing things into it that she never once mentioned. 

Time for your Performance Evaluation?

You can interpret her statement if you want but it is dishonest to claim your interpretation as what she actually said.  Your choice of course but I choose facts.

 :stopjack:

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #85 on: May 24, 2020, 09:20:19 PM »
You can interpret her statement if you want but it is dishonest to claim your interpretation as what she actually said.  Your choice of course but I choose facts.

 :stopjack:

There's nothing that prevents you from posting the "Back to Topic" emoji without first posting something totally off topic.

That's got to be the most chickeshit move in a forum.   :wacko:
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

eyeeatingfish

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #86 on: May 24, 2020, 09:35:02 PM »
That's got to be the most chickeshit move in a forum.

Said the chicken expert

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #87 on: May 24, 2020, 10:05:31 PM »
Said the chicken expert

More off topic posting after the stop-jack emoji?

Hypocrite!   :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:  :geekdanc: :geekdanc: :geekdanc:
« Last Edit: May 24, 2020, 10:11:40 PM by Flapp_Jackson »
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Bota-CS1

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #88 on: May 25, 2020, 07:44:49 AM »
Archery got some press in the SA about how they’re not able to use the parks. 
No one is coming, it’s up to us.

Legislation should never be about depriving law abiding citizens of something, but rather taking those things away from criminals.

Brystont1

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #89 on: May 25, 2020, 09:32:59 AM »
Not playing devi'ls advocate, only pointing out what she actually said. You can assume her motives all you want but you can't state them as if they were her words, that is just misinformation.

If you want to jump to that conclusion I certainly can't stop you.

Lol ok so what was she actually trying to say?

aieahound

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #90 on: May 25, 2020, 09:48:34 AM »
Archery got some press in the SA about how they’re not able to use the parks. 

Yup. Archery got a full article in this morning’s paper about their range not re-opening.
City guy said concern about gathering and crowds is a factor.
Apparently he hasn’t been to Ala Moana Beach Park since it re-opened.

QUIETShooter

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #91 on: May 25, 2020, 05:36:22 PM »
Yup. Archery got a full article in this morning’s paper about their range not re-opening.
City guy said concern about gathering and crowds is a factor.
Apparently he hasn’t been to Ala Moana Beach Park since it re-opened.

After watching the news today and seeing how nuts it was over the Memorial Day weekend this "City guy" can take a flying f*#k at a rolling doughnut for all I care.

His concern about gatherings and crowds at the range is bullshit.  We law abiding gun owners who believe in the 2nd amendment are "criminals" in their eyes and are at the very bottom of their list.  Their allegiance is to the developers in construction, the lawyers and politicians who miss golf, and to parks, beaches, tourists and our local lemmings who follow and obey, especially during election time where they don't vote their mind, they vote what others tell them to.
Sometimes you gotta know when to save your bullets.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #92 on: May 25, 2020, 05:42:11 PM »
After watching the news today and seeing how nuts it was over the Memorial Day weekend this "City guy" can take a flying f*#k at a rolling doughnut for all I care.

His concern about gatherings and crowds at the range is bullshit.  We law abiding gun owners who believe in the 2nd amendment are "criminals" in their eyes and are at the very bottom of their list.  Their allegiance is to the developers in construction, the lawyers and politicians who miss golf, and to parks, beaches, tourists and our local lemmings who follow and obey, especially during election time where they don't vote their mind, they vote what others tell them to.

Ted Kennedy killed more people with his car than I ever have with my gun.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

ren

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #93 on: May 25, 2020, 05:50:52 PM »
After watching the news today and seeing how nuts it was over the Memorial Day weekend this "City guy" can take a flying f*#k at a rolling doughnut for all I care.

His concern about gatherings and crowds at the range is bullshit.  We law abiding gun owners who believe in the 2nd amendment are "criminals" in their eyes and are at the very bottom of their list.  Their allegiance is to the developers in construction, the lawyers and politicians who miss golf, and to parks, beaches, tourists and our local lemmings who follow and obey, especially during election time where they don't vote their mind, they vote what others tell them to.

no tickets, no arrests
imagine if shooters showed up at the range and ran it. cleaned up and left it in a good condition they'd be arrested and all their firearms confiscated.
https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2020/05/25/weekend-parties-leave-oahu-beaches-trashed-raise-concern-about-spread-virus/
No one was issued a citation, but before they could leave Honolulu police and state conservation officers made partygoers carry out what was carried in.

but if you are a tourist who breaks quarantine they are all over them :thumbsup:
« Last Edit: May 25, 2020, 09:04:22 PM by ren »
Deeds Not Words

stangzilla

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #94 on: May 26, 2020, 07:48:21 AM »
no tickets, no arrests
imagine if shooters showed up at the range and ran it. cleaned up and left it in a good condition they'd be arrested and all their firearms confiscated.
https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/2020/05/25/weekend-parties-leave-oahu-beaches-trashed-raise-concern-about-spread-virus/
No one was issued a citation, but before they could leave Honolulu police and state conservation officers made partygoers carry out what was carried in.

but if you are a tourist who breaks quarantine they are all over them :thumbsup:

no consequenses. that tells me that there will be more bonfires next week

stangzilla

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #95 on: May 26, 2020, 07:57:33 AM »
keep on emailing....

Mayor Caldwell / Governor Ige ,
I would like to urge you to open Kokohead shooting complex as soon as possible. The shooting range would be relatively easy to maintain social distancing guidelines and maintain cleanliness.  It would be easier to enforce than all other parks because there are Range Safety Officers at the range to enforce rules, and you have to sign in to use the range. No other parks do this.  In all other parks there is little to no enforcement of rules.  Not so at Kokohead Shooting Complex. Therefore it is easier to track users of the park and easier to enforce rules at the shooting range than it is at any other park. 
kokohead also stimulates economy. firearms and ammo is expensive. then we need a car to get there, gas, food, shoes, clothes, glasses, hat, sunscreen, earplugs, earmuffs, sanitizer, spray disinfectant, reloading supplies. With proper guidelines in place, which would be very easy to put together with constant enforcement of rules by Range Safety Officers and the best contact tracing with the sign up sheets, Kokohead Shooting Complex will be one of the safest activities on the island.
The shooting range is a well used park, many citizens are anxiously waiting for it to reopen. Please reopen Kokohead Shooting Complex ASAP.
thank you,
***** ********

QUIETShooter

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #96 on: May 26, 2020, 08:07:11 AM »
no consequenses. that tells me that there will be more bonfires next week

If had about 15-20 people the cops would've said "I go arrest um".

But because they had close to 200 people they said "Ahhh….ass ok.  I lazy...…"

Above comments are made tongue in cheek, just poking fun and being snarky. ;)



Sometimes you gotta know when to save your bullets.

stangzilla

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #97 on: May 26, 2020, 08:35:37 AM »
revised a little

To Whom it may concern:



I would like to urge you to open Kokohead shooting complex as soon as possible. The shooting range would be relatively easy to maintain social distancing guidelines and maintain cleanliness.  It would be easier to enforce than all other parks because there are Range Safety Officers at the range to enforce rules, and you have to sign in to use the range. No other parks do this.  In all other parks there is little to no enforcement of rules.  Not so at Kokohead Shooting Complex. Therefore it is easier to track users of the park and easier to enforce rules at the shooting range than it is at any other park. kokohead also stimulates economy. firearms and ammo is expensive. then we need a car to get there, gas, food, shoes, clothes, glasses, hat, sunscreen, earplugs, earmuffs, sanitizer, spray disinfectant, reloading supplies. With proper guidelines in place, which would be very easy to put together with constant enforcement of rules by Range Safety Officers and the best contact tracing with the sign up sheets, Kokohead Shooting Complex will be one of the safest activities on the island.


The shooting range is a well used park, many citizens are anxiously waiting for it to reopen. There are numerous supporters of the Second Amendment that are feeling left out in all the reopenings. Please reopen Kokohead Shooting Complex ASAP.




thank you,
***** ********



sent to:
kmpine@honolulu.gov, htsuneyoshi@honolulu.gov, ianderson@honolulu.gov, tommy.waters@honolulu.gov, akobayashi@honolulu.gov, cafukunaga@honolulu.gov, jmanahan@honolulu.gov, belefante@honolulu.gov, repkobayashi@Capitol.hawaii.gov, senihara@capitol.hawaii.gov, sennishihara@capitol.hawaii.gov, senshimabukuro@capitol.hawaii.gov, sentaniguchi@capitol.hawaii.gov, senthielen@capitol.hawaii.gov, senwakai@capitol.hawaii.gov, senkim@capitol.hawaii.gov, senkidani@capitol.hawaii.gov, senkeohokalole@capitol.hawaii.gov, senharimoto@capitol.hawaii.gov, sengabbard@capitol.hawaii.gov, senfevella@capitol.hawaii.gov, sendelacruz@capitol.hawaii.gov, repaquino@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repbelatti@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repbrower@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repcabanilla@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repcachola@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repcullen@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repeli@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repgates@Capitol.hawaii.gov, rephar@Capitol.hawaii.gov, rephashem@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repholt@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repichiyama@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repjohanson@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repkitagawa@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repkobayashi@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repdkobayashi@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repkong@Capitol.hawaii.gov, replee@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repluke@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repmatayoshi@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repmatsumoto@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repmcdermott@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repmckelvey@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repmizuno@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repnishimoto@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repohno@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repokimoto@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repperruso@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repquinlan@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repsaiki@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repsay@Capitol.hawaii.gov, reptakayama@Capitol.hawaii.gov, reptakumi@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repthielen@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repward@Capitol.hawaii.gov, repyamane@Capitol.hawaii.gov

stangzilla

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #98 on: May 26, 2020, 08:48:12 AM »
got a reply from the Covid Response Team:

Quote
Aloha,
 
 Thank you for taking the time to voice your concerns. Please know that Mayor Caldwell and the entire City Administration is working hard to chart a safe and gradual path towardslifting current emergency restrictions and opening up the economy.
 
Please note, all City and County of Honolulu parks (except Hanauma Bay Nature Preserve and Koko Head Shooting Complex),are open only for Authorized Park Activities as outlined under Mayor Caldwell’s  Emergency Order 2020-11. Archery ranges are still closed for the public at this time until further notice although we will likely open them up some time in the near future. We are working on a phased re-opening of these facilities.
 
 Determinations regarding the re-opening of facilities and the timeline for doing so are being made in consultation with epidemiologists, public health experts, and medical professionalswith these four factors being taken into consideration:
 1. Epidemiology of COVID-19 in Hawaiʻi – Analysis of the trends in the number of cases in Hawaiʻi and for those thatdo test positive and how are they getting the disease, while also looking at who is getting sick (e.g., healthcare workers, vulnerable populations, etc.);
2. Healthcare system readiness – Ensuring the healthcare system on Oʻahu can handle not only the existing patientload, but any potential increases in cases. This includes sufficient staffing, equipment, and enough PPEs, as well as having more effective treatment such as antivirals or other medication, etc.;
3. Public health system readiness – Ability for the State Department of Health (DOH) to immediately conduct contracttracing, quarantine, isolation, etc.;
4. Societal readiness – Everyone on-island following social distancing and other CDC and DOH guidelines, with businessesand workplaces effectively implementing related measures.
 
 We understand this is a very difficult time, and we appreciate the cooperation of our community as we work together to limit the spread andimpact of this pandemic. We hope to start relaxing the restrictions based on assessing the risks to the community and the results from more testing for cases. Thank you for understanding the need tostay at home and helping to keep our Oʻahu safe.
 
Sincerely,
 
 
 
City and County of Honolulu
 
COVID-19 Response Information Team
 
 
 
For additional information, including FAQs, go to:www.oneoahu.org
 
For State Department of Health information and updates on COVID-19, go to:https://hawaiicovid19.com
 
For other referral services, go to: www.auw211.org


in other words, they don't know crap either

stangzilla

Re: Email the Mayor - range re-opening
« Reply #99 on: May 26, 2020, 12:07:39 PM »
got this reply from my state rep Bert Kobayashi:

Quote
Aloha, ***** *,
 
As you seem to know, given your list of addressees, the Koko Head shooting range is operated by C&C parks and recreation. 
 
The separation between City govt and State govt is huge [e.g., State legislators rarely interact with City officials except for Councilmembers who often handleneighborhood complaints], hence may I suggest to focus on City officials, including the Mayor and director of City parks and recreation.
 
/bert kobayashi
 
  State Representative
 
  Diamond Head, Kahala, Kaimuki, Kapahulu


well, I guess this is out of his jurisdiction.  at least he pointed me to another person I can email - director of city parks and rec.  but who's that?