HI is a criminals paradise.  No one is armed, at most it's a knife or OC.  And even they do get arrested, they will be released early, unless they chose the wrong person to violate (like an assistant prosecutor).

HI is a criminals paradise.  No one is armed, at most it's a knife or OC.  And even they do get arrested, they will be released early, unless they chose the wrong person to violate (like an assistant prosecutor).

. . . Or state officials.

Here is a new tactic that criminals might use.

Criminal: I like your shiny diamond ring, auntie. You hand it over, and I be nice. You not give it to me and I twist it off.

Woman of the House: That was a threat to my life, and I shoot your head off.

Justice Dept. State of HI: The shooter is charged with second degree murder. Reasoning, the criminal did not attack her. Taking a ring off a finger, even with the use of force, is not the threat of deadly bodily harm.

Here is another case criminals can win. Suppose your dog hears a burglar in the house, and the dog bites the thief's arm. With his free arm, he starts to beat the dog with a bat. Homeowner sees his/her beloved pet being struck and nearly killed. Homeowner shoots the thief. Guess who gets to sue the homeowner for the use of deadly force? The perp. Nothing in the law prevents this egregious misapplication of justice.

. . . Or state officials.

Here is a new tactic that criminals might use.

Criminal: I like your shiny diamond ring, auntie. You hand it over, and I be nice. You not give it to me and I twist it off.

Woman of the House: That was a threat to my life, and I shoot your head off.

Justice Dept. State of HI: The shooter is charged with second degree murder. Reasoning, the criminal did not attack her. Taking a ring off a finger, even with the use of force, is not the threat of deadly bodily harm.

Here is another case criminals can win. Suppose your dog hears a burglar in the house, and the dog bites the thief's arm. With his free arm, he starts to beat the dog with a bat. Homeowner sees his/her beloved pet being struck and nearly killed. Homeowner shoots the thief. Guess who gets to sue the homeowner for the use of deadly force? The perp. Nothing in the law prevents this egregious misapplication of justice.

Case #1:  If the ring-thief is killed, it's her word against the dead attacker's.  Unless she incriminates herself, she only has to say she feared for her life.  If the guy was armed, the fear is even more reasonable.  If he lives, it's still he said - she said.  Whether or not he intended to hurt her IF she complied, he still admitted hurting her was contingent on her resisting.  Nothing in the law negates assault charges if the victim doesn't cooperate.   

Case #2:  The law allows residents to assume if someone is committing violence on their property and they were not invited, it's reasonable to assume the person is a threat.  Whether or not lethal force is needed is not a factor.  Private citizens are not trained police officers.  We do not have to adhere to a continuum of force policy.  If we can retreat, that's always an option, but inside your home, you have no DUTY to do so.

In all cases, use of lethal/deadly force is a life changing decision.  Even if it's 100% justified, the gov't doesn't seek to prosecute, and the threat happened to be a serial killer, you still have to deal with PTSD and the guilt of having to take another person's life. 

I'm not so concerned about what the state will do to me.  I know deep down that I will only pull a trigger if it is my last option.  Anyone who says otherwise ("I know where to dig the hole") should not offer anyone advice.  Do what you want.  I'll do the same.

Actually, there is something in the law that PUNISHES the state for "the egregious misapplication of justice."  Aside from civil remedies for violating your Constitutional rights, state officials can also be prosecuted if their actions are that egregious.  I'd refer you to the Kealoha case and all the people charged and convicted for their illegal abuse of power.  That's not the norm, but safeguards do exist.

A couple of weeks ago, I visited my bank to pay the mortgage. Outside, a flimsy armored car was parked, and three guards entered the bank openly carrying pistols (holstered). Because (it seems) guards are one of the few professions that are allowed to carry guns, why don't more people train to be guards? This is probably one of the safest jobs you can find. Why? Thieves seem to like to break into armored vehicles when the drivers are eating food or getting massaged. Or, the guards are co-conspirators in the robberies.

https://www.khon2.com/local-news/2-men-involved-in-armored-car-heist-charged-with-conspiracy/

The more thieves learn about Hawaii being a criminal paradise, the more likely the roaches will move from red states to paradise. With roaches, you need to plant bait wisely. Put defective guns with squibs in easy to find boxes that say Glock or Colt. Robbers try to be clever by not carrying guns, but when they find a gun in your house, their natural instinct is to point the gun at you. At that stage, you can fire in self-defense.

Have you ever wondered why gun stores in this state are almost never robbed? Because illegal guns are easy to find, and the gun stores essentially carry little cash.

A couple of weeks ago, I visited my bank to pay the mortgage. Outside, a flimsy armored car was parked, and three guards entered the bank openly carrying pistols (holstered). Because (it seems) guards are one of the few professions that are allowed to carry guns, why don't more people train to be guards? This is probably one of the safest jobs you can find. Why? Thieves seem to like to break into armored vehicles when the drivers are eating food or getting massaged. Or, the guards are co-conspirators in the robberies.

https://www.khon2.com/local-news/2-men-involved-in-armored-car-heist-charged-with-conspiracy/

The more thieves learn about Hawaii being a criminal paradise, the more likely the roaches will move from red states to paradise. With roaches, you need to plant bait wisely. Put defective guns with squibs in easy to find boxes that say Glock or Colt. Robbers try to be clever by not carrying guns, but when they find a gun in your house, their natural instinct is to point the gun at you. At that stage, you can fire in self-defense.

Have you ever wondered why gun stores in this state are almost never robbed? Because illegal guns are easy to find, and the gun stores essentially carry little cash.

It's not enough to be trained as a guard.  Unless you are on the clock at your security guard job, you can't carry.  If you aren't employed as a guard, your security guard training doesn't authorize any carry privileges.  Permits to carry for guards are issued in conjunction with your employer.  No security guard employer, no permit.

There are security guards on this forum.  I'm sure they can fill in the details, but that's the basic situation as I understand it.

As for gun shops being robbed, most employees are permitted to carry while working.  The laws allow you to keep firearms at your place of business as long as the owner approves.  Carry of firearms in Hawaii is not prohibited in private spaces (it actually is in some other states without a carry permit  ).  So, having a store with armed employees works just like having armed guards at banks.  Robbers pick the path of least resistance.

I plan to dial 911 and keep it on if I ever find myself in a potentially dangerous situation.

And I will speak loud and clear and if possible encourage the f**kn perp to do the same.  (You know, pretend to not hear and ask the asshat to repeat....."eh?? wat you said??  hah???)

You know, it's bad enough that Hawaii has a kinder and gentler approach to treating criminals.  But to also let them go or dismiss the case (as most often happens than not) is just mind-boggling.  The least they can do is prosecute to the full extent of the law (does Hawaii even know this phrase?) instead of treating these low life bastards better than the victimized law-abiding citizen.

Duty to retreat, they say?  Yeah, I guess have to.  Not worth it with these stupid laws.  Never even once thought about it when I was younger but now that I'm old I sometimes think about it and say f**k it, ainokea.  Take my chances.

I plan to dial 911 and keep it on if I ever find myself in a potentially dangerous situation.

And I will speak loud and clear and if possible encourage the f**kn perp to do the same.  (You know, pretend to not hear and ask the asshat to repeat....."eh?? wat you said??  hah???)

You know, it's bad enough that Hawaii has a kinder and gentler approach to treating criminals.  But to also let them go or dismiss the case (as most often happens than not) is just mind-boggling.  The least they can do is prosecute to the full extent of the law (does Hawaii even know this phrase?) instead of treating these low life bastards better than the victimized law-abiding citizen.

Duty to retreat, they say?  Yeah, I guess have to.  Not worth it with these stupid laws.  Never even once thought about it when I was younger but now that I'm old I sometimes think about it and say f**k it, ainokea.  Take my chances.

Keep in mind the 911 recording can be used in court. And under stress, u may say something bad.



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Keep in mind the 911 recording can be used in court. And under stress, u may say something bad.

Do ya feel lucky, punk?

Well, do ya?      

Do ya feel lucky, punk?

Well, do ya?      

He did recover from COVID, so. . .

He did recover from COVID, so. . .

I was lucky. Lol

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I was lucky. Lol

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So, are you the type that when you’re lucky, you want to say go Vegas and test the good luck?  Or the type where you think “damn, I used my good luck, so now can’t take chances?”

So yeah, you never answered FJ’s question.   

 

So, are you the type that when you’re lucky, you want to say go Vegas and test the good luck?  Or the type where you think “damn, I used my good luck, so now can’t take chances?”

So yeah, you never answered FJ’s question.   

 

I was illustrating what you might not want recorded on that 911 call.

So, are you the type that when you’re lucky, you want to say go Vegas and test the good luck?  Or the type where you think “damn, I used my good luck, so now can’t take chances?”

So yeah, you never answered FJ’s question.   

 

The wife and i have an agreement. If we ever hit the mega bucks, $1 mil is going toward lawsuits for gun rights.

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I was illustrating what you might not want recorded on that 911 call.

Yeah, I got that. I was just teasing CMO

The wife and i have an agreement. If we ever hit the mega bucks, $1 mil is going toward lawsuits for gun rights.

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So do ya feel lucky? Huh punk? 

 

So do ya feel lucky? Huh punk? 

 

Thats gun to buy is also on the list. I shot someones highway patrol revolver when we had the last gathering. I really enjoyed it. I think it was stangs? Or maybe OFs.

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Thats gun to buy is also on the list. I shot someones highway patrol revolver when we had the last gathering. I really enjoyed it. I think it was stangs? Or maybe OFs.

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I wouldn't mind a Dirty Harry gun as well.  I have a Ruger Redhawk .44 Mag.  That's a fun gun to shoot at the sihouette range, but with a 7.5" barrel, it's a beast. 

I bet you shot dogman's.  I have a predecessor (or at least I believe so) of that highway patrolman revolver.  dogman told me about the differences before, but I forget. 

I wouldn't mind a Dirty Harry gun as well.  I have a Ruger Redhawk .44 Mag.  That's a fun gun to shoot at the sihouette range, but with a 7.5" barrel, it's a beast. 

I bet you shot dogman's.  I have a predecessor (or at least I believe so) of that highway patrolman revolver.  dogman told me about the differences before, but I forget.

After shooting dogman's 500, mrs. CMO wants 1.  The only thing holding us back is ammo.  Last trip we made to Vegas (2019) I did see 50 cal ammo on the shelf, among other cool ammo like rock salt shotgun, dragons breath, 223 blanks, RIP ammo, etc....  But I didn't look if they had 500 AE ammo. Since I don't reload, that would be the best option, to bring back from Vegas.

After shooting dogman's 500, mrs. CMO wants 1.  The only thing holding us back is ammo. Last trip we made to Vegas (2019) I did see 50 cal ammo on the shelf, among other cool ammo like rock salt shotgun, dragons breath, 223 blanks, RIP ammo, etc....  But I didn't look if they had 500 AE ammo. Since I don't reload, that would be the best option, to bring back from Vegas.

Uh, first thing.  Does Mrs. CMO frequent these boards? 

Second, I've shot said 500 and others.  As much fun as dogman has shooting those, after maybe 2-3 shots, I'm over it.  haha

Uh, first thing.  Does Mrs. CMO frequent these boards? 

Second, I've shot said 500 and others.  As much fun as dogman has shooting those, after maybe 2-3 shots, I'm over it.  haha

Luckily she doesn't.  But I fill her in on important stuff.  I know she wont shoot it often, but I buy what the wife wants. Happy wife, happy husband who can spend $ on what ever he wants like a 1911 and all the gear needed.

Sorry if I derailed this thread OP.