Then add in the bill that restricts where tasers can be carried. So a double whammy of places where 1 could carry a gun if allowed in HI, but cannot because 1 also has to carry a taser which has a separate restriction of areas.

Not gonna happen.

The USSC is gonna put a lot of anti constitutional states in check. Thank God.

They already ruled you can carry for self defense purposes. Hawaii is in violation of that as currently written in the HRS.
 States are trying to apply that to the home only. The USSC is gonna make their heads spin.

The problem is people will have to bear the burden of the court battle all the way up out of the 9th Circuit. Also known as guilty until proven innocent in the 9th circuit.

Democrats hate your guns

I fear it is going to get worse. The state legislature has unlimited amounts of money to add more and more provisions into the law. Right now, armed guards can get CCW permits in HI, because their employers carry millions of dollars of liability insurance.

Individual gun owners usually do not have deep pockets. So, guess what the state is going to do- they will require you to be tested for handgun proficiency, similar to the way Federal Air Marshals are licensed. They are going to sneak this requirement into the law using the 14th Amendment due process clause, which I believe is the way states can disallow felons, criminally insane and mental defectives from possessing handguns.

To get a NV ccw permit you have to.pass a 30 shot proficiency test.

To get a NV ccw permit you have to.pass a 30 shot proficiency test.

21 states now have permit-less / Constitutional carry laws.  If you are legally able to own a handgun, you are legally allowed to carry it.

That's fast approaching 1/2 the states in the US!!

Some states have restrictions, for example North Dakota.  You must be a resident for a month before you're allowed to carry.  Only concealed carry is allowed -- no open carry.  Doesn't apply to non-residents.

Most of these states continue to honor CCW permits issued by other states with which they have a reciprocity agreement.  Most also allow you to apply for a CCW permit if you want it to use the reciprocity feature in other states as you travel.

I've taken the 30-rd CCW live fire test in NV.  If you fail that, you definitely are not to be trusted with a gun around other people!  In the grand scheme, requiring a test begs two questions:  (1) who decides on the standards to use -- could be too easy or could be too difficult to pass, and (2) name another Constitutionally protected right that you can only exercise if you pass a test.  If you're lost on that last point, look up Voter Registration Literacy Tests.

Some states have issued carry permits to people in spite of the applicant being legally blind.  Yet, we can't get a permit issued in Hawaii DUE TO blindness .... of the state to recognize a right as a right.

21 states now have permit-less / Constitutional carry laws.  If you are legally able to own a handgun, you are legally allowed to carry it.

That's fast approaching 1/2 the states in the US!!

Some states have restrictions, for example North Dakota.  You must be a resident for a month before you're allowed to carry.  Only concealed carry is allowed -- no open carry.  Doesn't apply to non-residents.

Most of these states continue to honor CCW permits issued by other states with which they have a reciprocity agreement.  Most also allow you to apply for a CCW permit if you want it to use the reciprocity feature in other states as you travel.

I've taken the 30-rd CCW live fire test in NV.  If you fail that, you definitely are not to be trusted with a gun around other people!  In the grand scheme, requiring a test begs two questions:  (1) who decides on the standards to use -- could be too easy or could be too difficult to pass, and (2) name another Constitutionally protected right that you can only exercise if you pass a test.  If you're lost on that last point, look up Voter Registration Literacy Tests.

Some states have issued carry permits to people in spite of the applicant being legally blind.  Yet, we can't get a permit issued in Hawaii DUE TO blindness .... of the state to recognize a right as a right.

There is no standard nor caliber specified. Pretty much everyone passes it.

So 22 pistol at 5 yards on paper.

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I've taken the 30-rd CCW live fire test in NV.  If you fail that, you definitely are not to be trusted with a gun around other people!

According to youtube, the test is conducted at the 7, 5 and 3 yd lines.  Passing requirement is 70%. However, CA requires the test be run at the 15, 10 and 7 yd lines. I predict that HI will use CA distances with 90% proficiency, in wind. That will require expensive splatter target paper with an 8x8' boundary to count the missed shots. .22 LR pistols may be used but the license may restrict you to only carry the caliber that you used to pass the test. Scoring .22LR shots is not that simple due to bullet-hole size.
How many of us can meet the 90% proficiency requirement at 15 yards with a 9mm or 45ACP pistol, in a live (exterior) setting?

According to youtube, the test is conducted at the 7, 5 and 3 yd lines.  Passing requirement is 70%. However, CA requires the test be run at the 15, 10 and 7 yd lines. I predict that HI will use CA distances with 90% proficiency, in wind. That will require expensive splatter target paper with an 8x8' boundary to count the missed shots. .22 LR pistols may be used but the license may restrict you to only carry the caliber that you used to pass the test. Scoring .22LR shots is not that simple due to bullet-hole size.
How many of us can meet the 90% proficiency requirement at 15 yards with a 9mm or 45ACP pistol, in a live (exterior) setting?

Actually, we used standard Front Sight human silhouette targets, which would be appropriate at those ranges.  Anything smaller would require adjusting the distances.

If you can't locate a bullet hole for each round fired, and the major grouping appears to be consistent, then you can assume that a 3-4 inch diameter hole is where the ones you can't count exited.  That's how most competitions work, too.  It's highly unlikely someone with a good grouping missed the target completely, since it's a rather large target.

For NV, the test required the rounds land in the thoracic or ocular-cranial region of the target.  There are no rings like on a bullseye target.  Scoring is either hit or miss.  So, making the 90% standard is easy.  For 30 rds, that means 27 need to be inside the target areas. 

15 yards is still 10 yards closer than the targets at the KHSC pistol range. 


 

I tend to doubt that the state of Hawaii will make the CCW test as easy as it is in Nevada. There was an indoor range in NV that claimed you can keep repeating the live fire section of the test until you scored 70% or higher. We only have two indoor ranges in Oahu, and they would love having the legislature impose these requirements- only one attempt per course and you need to get off 5 shots every 10 seconds, to simulate a real self-defense response. At $900 per training/test course, the indoor ranges would rake in a fortune. What is the accuracy rate when the test forces you into a lizard brain state of mind? This video gives you an answer based on actual experience.

At $900 for a course, nobody will sign up.  Hard to make a fortune when you price yourself out of a new market with pent up demand.

FWIW, this is from an Arizona 2A forum, these reasons to get a CCW in a Constitutional carry state (Arizona in this case) may partly apply in the impossible chance of Hawaii decides to follow the Constituion.


    Reciprocity – If you ever travel outside of Arizona you will want a permit in order to continue to carry concealed. Currently over 30 states honor or have reciprocity with the Arizona CCW permit. Without the permit you cannot carry in any of those states.

    Restaurants Serving Alcohol – With the Arizona CCW permit you may carry your concealed weapon in restaurants or businesses that serve alcohol for consumption on the premises (you still can’t drink and the restaurant still may have a sign prohibiting firearms). Without a permit you cannot carry in these places at all. That includes popular family restaurants that serve alcohol.

    Without a permit you cannot take advantage of the right to carry into National Parks within the state of Arizona.

    Without a permit you can not carry your firearm within 1000 feet of a school. Do you realize how difficult it is to avoid 1000 feet boundries of every school in the state? (Federal Gun-Free School Zones Act)

    City of Phoenix ordinances prohibits the possession of a firearm in a city park of 1 square mile or less where posted “Carrying a firearm in this park is limited to persons who possess a permit issued pursuant to A.R.S. § 13-3112.”

    If you have a permit the process of obtaining a background check when you purchase a firearm is streamlined.

    Having a permit makes it easier for law enforcement to identify you as a person who has gone through a legal process to obtain training and education. It also proves to them that you can pass a rigorous background check, whereas people who don’t have a permit perhaps chose not to undergo the scrutiny of a background check. It says a lot about you when you find yourself in a confrontation (like a traffic stop) and you have a firearm.

    Your attorney will thank you. When you eventually end up in court to defend your own firearm related actions you will be more defend-able from charges like recklessness and negligence.

    Probably the greatest and most important reason however is the training. While we don’t feel that citizens should be legally required to obtain training in order to exercise a constitutional right; we do understand how critical training and education is.

..... they would love having the legislature impose these requirements- only one attempt per course and you need to get off 5 shots every 10 seconds, to simulate a real self-defense response.

I was watching a video by Jerry Miculek and he said you should be able to put 2 shots into 4 targets as fast as you can put 8 shots into 1.  He proceeded to demonstrate by first firing 8 shots into 1 target in 1 second.  He then fired 2 shots each into 4 different targets in 1 second.  I would feel sorry for a perp who doesn't know who he is and pulls a gun on what appears to be a defenseless old man.

We have seen what HI did with taser requirements. Ccw/oc would be worst. People here better testify IF a bill is made, or NO GRUMBLE.

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