WTF.  Just send these multi-million dollar tanks to Ukraine with no trained tank crews.

A state of the art cutting edge tank is worthless if the crew doesn't know a f**kn thing as to how to use it.

We have an idiot for a POTUS.  Likes to waste other people's money.  A$$hole....

https://www.newsweek.com/abrams-tanks-ukraine-russia-war-us-veteran-1779164#:~:text=No%20matter%20how%20well%20the%20Ukrainian%20tankers%20have,the%20work%20of%20years%2C%20not%20weeks%20or%20months.

I'm sure the Russians and Chinese will have fun taking them apart and finding critical vulnerabilities.

They will be trained. Are you pro Putin and anti-Ukraine ? Anti democracy too?

No other choices? We call this a 1 sided option.

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They will be trained. Are you pro Putin and anti-Ukraine ? Anti democracy too?

How about training them first.  Just because I question what our leaders are doing does not make me pro Putin, anti-Ukraine, nor against democracy.

You really are a f**kn troll.

Training involves much more than operation.  Our resident know-it-all hasn't got a clue.

Maintenance, repair, spare part acquisition, and diagnosing the mechanical and electronic systems takes years.

You can't just drop it off at the dealership when the targeting system won't power up or figure everything out from the owner's manual.  Today's weapons systems are extremely complex, require technical skills to operate and keep working, and need a supply chain in order to get spare parts.  No matter how resilient a part is, that doesn't protect against battle damage and unusually harsh operating conditions.

 

It will take some time before the tanks arrive and I am sure they are training as you are complaining.

Training to sell them on the black market?

It will take some time before the tanks arrive and I am sure they are training as you are complaining.

Have you ever tried training forreign nationals on US weapons systems?  I have.

It took 3-4 years for Boeing to deliver 4 E-3 AWACS aircraft to Riyadh.  In that time, the US flew our own AWACS doing 24/7/365 sorties with Saudi national officers, and US ground support worked with their techs to get them ready.

You can't expect the new operators and support personnel to become proficient over "some time."  And they are not training now,  They can't until the tanks are there.  What are they going to train on?  Simulators they don't have?

Have you ever tried training forreign nationals on US weapons systems?  I have.

It took 3-4 years for Boeing to deliver 4 E-3 AWACS aircraft to Riyadh.  In that time, the US flew our own AWACS doing 24/7/365 sorties with Saudi national officers, and US ground support worked with their techs to get them ready.

You can't expect the new operators and support personnel to become proficient over "some time."  And they are not training now,  They can't until the tanks are there.  What are they going to train on?  Simulators they don't have?

Our rhesident military expert reminds me of someone....same mistakes and still didnt read past threads.

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Our rhesident military expert reminds me of someone....same mistakes and still didnt read past threads.

I was a Software Engineer for AWACS, and much of the process in delivering them to the Saudis was spent developing a releasable version that would not impact US operations and capabilities.

Just one of many aspects where foreign military sales is concerned.

read the fine print.
They can't get their tanks for about two years.
 

Have you ever tried training forreign nationals on US weapons systems?  I have.

It took 3-4 years for Boeing to deliver 4 E-3 AWACS aircraft to Riyadh.  In that time, the US flew our own AWACS doing 24/7/365 sorties with Saudi national officers, and US ground support worked with their techs to get them ready.

You can't expect the new operators and support personnel to become proficient over "some time."  And they are not training now,  They can't until the tanks are there.  What are they going to train on?  Simulators they don't have?

Obviously this person has not served in the military.  A Tanker recruit goes through 13 weeks of training at the Armor School at Fort Knox.

That's just the beginning.  Then there is more training and certifications along the way at his assigned  duty station. 

You don't just "drive" the damn thing and look down the barrel sights like a rifle to fight the enemy.

What I was getting at is the high risk of a multi-million dollar vehicle getting destroyed in battle by a bunch of Ukranians with more balls than training.

And I also was criticizing our leadership.  You know, the same retard that handled the Afghanistan withdrawal.......

read the fine print.
They can't get their tanks for about two years.
 

Some sources say a matter of months.  Some say sometime in 2024.  I couldn't find more credible sources.

Some sources say a matter of months.  Some say sometime in 2024.  I couldn't find more credible sources.

When a politician or PR person says 'months', that could end up being 2 months, or it could stretch out to 12, 18, 24 ....

Forest for the trees. . . more nitwit distractions. . .

Obviously this person has not served in the military.  A Tanker recruit goes through 13 weeks of training at the Armor School at Fort Knox.

That's just the beginning.  Then there is more training and certifications along the way at his assigned  duty station. 

You don't just "drive" the damn thing and look down the barrel sights like a rifle to fight the enemy.

What I was getting at is the high risk of a multi-million dollar vehicle getting destroyed in battle by a bunch of Ukranians with more balls than training.

And I also was criticizing our leadership.  You know, the same retard that handled the Afghanistan withdrawal.......

I mean, 1 could just drive it. But it wont get very far.  The driver  has to understand the limitations, like dont drive over barbed wire.  Same for the other crew jobs.  I mean I guess it could run on a skeleton crew. Just need a gunner. He can move to load the gun himself, then take the time to go back to the gunner seat. No need a TC as the gunner could find his own targets, but all this would take much longer between shots.  Which is 1 reason why the US never adopted auto loaders like how the Russian Tanks have. A human loader can load much quicker.

Then add in all the support crews for PMCS. Maybe our Rhesident mechanic can be the E2 hard spot finder and exhaust sample taker.

I remember watching pre WW2 US military training on equipment. The budget was so low that they had to use cans of soup to mimic loading an artillery shell.  For grenades, they used bags of flower to throw at a replica tank (wood used as an  armor shape).  Maybe this is the training our military expert is suggesting be done since there are no simulators or equipment to live train on  like how Flapp mentioned in Ukraine.

Side note to the "could drive the tank". I had a conversation with a friend and I said I could fly a helicopter and all I would need is a few mins to "get the feel for her".  Compared to a plane, taking off is easy, but landing takes skill.  So I would not be able to land a plane by "getting the feel for her".

I talked to my friends dad who was a Huey pilot in NAM.  He said they didn't have simulators back then.  For their first flight they took them to an open field with a small chopper in the middle of it. That's how they learned to fly after all the book work was completed.  So he agreed, that I would be able to pilot a chopper by "getting the feel".

training for the challenger 2