Hearing on 3/15 @10am

https://hnldoc.ehawaii.gov/hnldoc/testimony

Use drop down box for "counsil meeting".

Then scroll down to select Bill 57.

This is the final hearing b4 it goes to Ricks desk.

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Anyone know the alterations to this version?

Anyone know the alterations to this version?

They added in a sign to allow guns is required. It has to be formatted to code and placed in accordance to specific code.

So they made it worst.

Lawsuit time.

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Do these restrictions also apply to Qualified Retired Law Enforcement Officers (QRLEOs) who carry under the Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act (LEOSA)?

I know several QRLEOs who do not keep up with these legal developments, who will be very disappointed, if these restrictions also apply to them.

Do these restrictions also apply to Qualified Retired Law Enforcement Officers (QRLEOs) who carry under the Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act (LEOSA)?

I know several QRLEOs who do not keep up with these legal developments, who will be very disappointed, if these restrictions also apply to them.

You should probably take a few minutes and read the proposed "Bill for an Ordinance," plus the entire HRS 134.  Consider 134 "required reading."

This will be on the test!  

(b) Exceptions. This prohibition does not apply to:
     (1) Persons exempted from HRS § 134-9 pursuant to HRS § 134-11; and
     (2) Qualified law enforcement officers and qualified retired law enforcement
           officers pursuant to 18 USC § 926B and 926C who have documentation
           regarding their qualifications in their immediate possession.

https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol03_Ch0121-0200D/HRS0134/HRS_0134-0011.htm


HRS 134-11 lists exemptions to sections within HRS 134, including HRS 134-9 Licenses to Carry.

https://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/Vol03_Ch0121-0200D/HRS0134/HRS_0134-0011.htm

Done

Update

Bill wont take effect upon signing. But instead May 1.

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Done

Thank you cmo

I have a question about this page:

https://hnldoc.ehawaii.gov/hnldoc/measure/2377

There is a column on the left "Approved Versions", and to the right another column "Proposed Drafts".  What is the difference between these two columns?  Is the most recent on the bottom, and oldest on the top?  So is this upcoming hearing for the ordinance on the bottom of the "Proposed Drafts" ?

Flapp_Jackson:  Thank you very much for your response to my inquiry.  Yes, I see it now.

Wait, when Flapp_Jackson provides this quote:

(b) Exceptions. This prohibition does not apply to:
     (1) Persons exempted from HRS § 134-9 pursuant to HRS § 134-11; and
     (2) Qualified law enforcement officers and qualified retired law enforcement
           officers pursuant to 18 USC § 926B and 926C who have documentation
           regarding their qualifications in their immediate possession.

... it is from or under section, "41-__.3 Prohibition against the public carrying of a pistol or revolver outside a residence without a license."  To me all this is saying is that QRLEOs can carry outside residence without this CCW license. 

But QRLEOs are not listed under the "(b) Exceptions" section that is under "41-__.4 Prohibition against the public carrying of firearms in a sensitive location—Prohibition against carrying a firearm on a private business establishment's or charitable establishment's premises without express consent."  QRLEOs do not seem to be exempt from the prohibitions of sensitive locations and private businesses (although there are the as-you-are-on-your-way exemptions A through D).

This is the version I am looking at:  https://hnldoc.ehawaii.gov/hnldoc/document-download?id=16655

Wait, when Flapp_Jackson provides this quote:
... it is from or under section, "41-__.3 Prohibition against the public carrying of a pistol or revolver outside a residence without a license."  To me all this is saying is that QRLEOs can carry outside residence without this CCW license. 

But QRLEOs are not listed under the "(b) Exceptions" section that is under "41-__.4 Prohibition against the public carrying of firearms in a sensitive location—Prohibition against carrying a firearm on a private business establishment's or charitable establishment's premises without express consent."  QRLEOs do not seem to be exempt from the prohibitions of sensitive locations and private businesses (although there are the as-you-are-on-your-way exemptions A through D).

This is the version I am looking at:  https://hnldoc.ehawaii.gov/hnldoc/document-download?id=16655

You're probably more interested in the second part of the exemptions described in the bill:

(b) Exceptions. This prohibition does not apply to:
     (1) Persons exempted from HRS § 134-9 pursuant to HRS § 134-11; and
     (2) Qualified law enforcement officers and qualified retired law enforcement
           officers pursuant to 18 USC § 926B and 926C who have documentation
           regarding their qualifications in their immediate possession.

926B. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers

https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title18-section926B&num=0&edition=prelim


§926C. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified retired law enforcement officers

https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title18-section926C&num=0&edition=prelim

I have a question about this page:

https://hnldoc.ehawaii.gov/hnldoc/measure/2377

There is a column on the left "Approved Versions", and to the right another column "Proposed Drafts".  What is the difference between these two columns?  Is the most recent on the bottom, and oldest on the top?  So is this upcoming hearing for the ordinance on the bottom of the "Proposed Drafts" ?

Flapp_Jackson:  Thank you very much for your response to my inquiry.  Yes, I see it now.

Yes. Use 2/28 version.

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Flapp_Jackson:  Thank you so very much for all your effort and time. 

Perhaps I am not clear, though:

The exemption for Qualified Retired Law Enforcement Officers (QLEOs) Flapp_Jackson cites...

(b) Exceptions. This prohibition does not apply to:
     (1) Persons exempted from HRS § 134-9 pursuant to HRS § 134-11; and
     (2) Qualified law enforcement officers and qualified retired law enforcement
           officers pursuant to 18 USC § 926B and 926C who have documentation
           regarding their qualifications in their immediate possession.

So my point is to examine what section does Flapp_Jackson's cited QRLEO exemption fall under:  (1) the CCW Permit section; or (2) the sensitive location/private property section?

The cited QRLEO section is from or under section, "41-__.3 Prohibition against the public carrying of a pistol or revolver outside a residence without a license.."  To me all this is saying is that QRLEOs can carry outside residence without this CCW license.

QRLEOs are NOT listed under the "(b) Exceptions" section that is under "41-__.4 Prohibition against the public carrying of firearms in a sensitive location—Prohibition against carrying a firearm on a private business establishment's or charitable establishment's premises without express consent."

So, as I see it, putting these two sections together ... QRLEO's are exempt from needing a CCW permit, but not exempt from limitations pertaining to sensitive locations and private property. 

----

And even federal law cited, Title 18 USC 926C (https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title18-section926C&num=0&edition=prelim), seems to allow States to enact such limitations/prohibitions.

Title 18 USC 926C Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified retired law enforcement officers

(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified retired law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection

(d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).
     (b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the
     laws of any State that-
          (1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the
          possession of concealed firearms on their property; or
          (2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local
          government property, installation, building, base, or park.

I read this as though QRLEO are subject to State laws that permit private perrons/entities or local governments to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property.


My point is ... alert every retired LEO you know, rally them to our cause, and get them submit testimony -- against these restrictions.

Specifically, Flapp_Jackson, thank you so very much for your posts.  Seriously.  Although I might disagree on some points, your postings here was very, very valuable.  And you have been so helpful in your hyperlinks, which I did not have before, and I have not definitely saved.  Mahalo Nui Loa.

And if I am incorrect, I prefer to be corrected, so that we can further our most worthy cause.

done

Me too.

done

Good job guys. It's sad with 800 apps pending, about 150-200 testimonies are submitted.

Good job guys. It's sad with 800 apps pending, about 150-200 testimonies are submitted.

well, do you have a way of informing all 800 applicants?

well, do you have a way of informing all 800 applicants?

Social media and coconut wireless.

I know 4 guys who refuse to submit for no other reason than lazyness or "it wont make a difference" attitude.  And I know a few more who have valid reasons (job, family, etc...) and more who "it doesn't affect me".

And I'm just 1 person.  So imagine if every CCW applicant or gun owner knows of a few people who won't help the cause without a good reason.

The bill that increases the gun safety class from 4hrs to 14 hrs got like 300 testimonies.  And no grandfather clause.  So every handgun owner should have submitted.  When the rifle mag ban came up a few years ago, we got 1500 testimonies just for reference.