http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/28/us/florida-music-shooting/index.html

Vigilante or not?

its stupid people like that who make people who CC and OC look bad...but, who knows what really happened.

Doesn't look too good at the moment, but again, who knows what went down and how? 

Edit to add:

Not vigilante, at least from what the article says.  A vigilante killing is when you exact street justice for something, not when you panic and shoot up a carload of kids.  Of course, the one thing you can count on, always and forever, is that the initial report will be wrong.

Agree...more like fear of being shot and reacting first, although they use the term vigilante. No gun found with the kids but only they know if they had one or not, at least for now.

vigilante?  no.



kind of a dumbass?   yeah.  saying you thought you saw a gun on the seat is a piss poor excuse to empty a mag at a car full of people, at a GAS STATION no less.  that alone proves how dumb he is.  its fools like this that turn into easy fodder for people to enact strict gun legislation.

I don't think the guy is dumb.

I don't think he is a vigilante.

I think he was scared.

A car load of black teens, or Hawaiian teens, or Mexican teens, or white teens, swearing at you and threatening you is scary.

Don't underestimate a 17 year olds ability to wreak havoc.

Ask yourself honestly, how long could you engage in a fist fight against a skilled opponent?

The truth for most of you, is about two minutes.

Then your "bad back", poor conditioning, lack of training, "bad knees" or just inability to take a punch would have you flat on your back bleeding from the nose.

A 17 year old however, regularly engages in 5-10 minute brawls.

Don't believe me? Do a YouTube search. You'll find hundreds of examples.

I don't know the facts of this individual incident. What I do know is what it feels to be beat on by 4 or 5 guys. It doesn't matter if they're 17 or 47, it can be deadly.

Lets not be so quick to judge this guy.

I don't think the guy is dumb.

I don't think he is a vigilante.

I think he was scared.

A car load of black teens, or Hawaiian teens, or Mexican teens, or white teens, swearing at you and threatening you is scary.

Don't underestimate a 17 year olds ability to wreak havoc.

Ask yourself honestly, how long could you engage in a fist fight against a skilled opponent?

The truth for most of you, is about two minutes.

Then your "bad back", poor conditioning, lack of training, "bad knees" or just inability to take a punch would have you flat on your back bleeding from the nose.

A 17 year old however, regularly engages in 5-10 minute brawls.

Don't believe me? Do a YouTube search. You'll find hundreds of examples.

I don't know the facts of this individual incident. What I do know is what it feels to be beat on by 4 or 5 guys. It doesn't matter if they're 17 or 47, it can be deadly.

Lets not be so quick to judge this guy.

My fist fight would last around 10 seconds then I would be looking at the sky.

That's what I was thinking when I said we don't know all the circumstances, and the first report is always wrong.  Everyone has this romantic idea that deadly force is only allowed if the two opponents are similarly armed, i.e. a "fair fight".  That's not the case.  If there are five of them, they have the capability to cause you death or serious bodily harm.  If they're hollering verbal threats at you, they have demonstrated an intent to cause you death or serious bodily harm.  If they're parked in the stall next to you, and they open their car door to get out, they have established the opportunity to cause you death or serious bodily harm.  Opportunity, capability, and intent are the three legs of the deadly force triangle. 

Not saying that's what happened, but if you read the Star Advertiser's initial coverage on the Elderts shooting, Christopher Deedy was undeniably a cold-blooded killer who tracked a gentle-hearted local boy to a McDonald's and gunned him down like a dog.  Just sayin'.

I don't think the guy is dumb.

I don't think he is a vigilante.

I think he was scared.

A car load of black teens, or Hawaiian teens, or Mexican teens, or white teens, swearing at you and threatening you is scary.

Don't underestimate a 17 year olds ability to wreak havoc.

Ask yourself honestly, how long could you engage in a fist fight against a skilled opponent?

The truth for most of you, is about two minutes.

Then your "bad back", poor conditioning, lack of training, "bad knees" or just inability to take a punch would have you flat on your back bleeding from the nose.

A 17 year old however, regularly engages in 5-10 minute brawls.

Don't believe me? Do a YouTube search. You'll find hundreds of examples.

I don't know the facts of this individual incident. What I do know is what it feels to be beat on by 4 or 5 guys. It doesn't matter if they're 17 or 47, it can be deadly.

Lets not be so quick to judge this guy.

I don't think the guy is dumb.

I don't think he is a vigilante.

I think he was scared.

A car load of black teens, or Hawaiian teens, or Mexican teens, or white teens, swearing at you and threatening you is scary.

Don't underestimate a 17 year olds ability to wreak havoc.

Ask yourself honestly, how long could you engage in a fist fight against a skilled opponent?

The truth for most of you, is about two minutes.

Then your "bad back", poor conditioning, lack of training, "bad knees" or just inability to take a punch would have you flat on your back bleeding from the nose.

A 17 year old however, regularly engages in 5-10 minute brawls.

Don't believe me? Do a YouTube search. You'll find hundreds of examples.

I don't know the facts of this individual incident. What I do know is what it feels to be beat on by 4 or 5 guys. It doesn't matter if they're 17 or 47, it can be deadly.

Lets not be so quick to judge this guy.

unless the story changes:

A) he shot at them before they even got out of the car.  that's just bogus. 

B) he opened fire in a GAS station.  that is DUMB.  there could have been an accident that hurt other, innocent people too.  that's reckless and stupid.



in my opinion, people "making threats" (which we also do not know what these "threats" were.  to what extent were they threats?  did they explicitly say they would attack him or hurt him, or was this just another case of him feeling scared, possibly irrationally?) in a car, who havent made a move to exit the car, is not a legitimate excuse to empty 8 rounds at them.  if they flashed a gun, sure.  if they got out and made a move, sure.  but if they havent left the car, that is seriously straining Stand your Ground, and quite honestly, is a chickenshit excuse firing 8 shots.  its supposed to be sefl defense, not "these guys are vaguely threatening to me, and they havent actually made a move yet, but im scared and irresponsible so i'm, going to unload on them, just in case". 

you're responsible for every bullet that comes out of your gun.  owning a gun and having the ability to protect yourself with lethal force is a huge responsibility.  and part of that responsibility is being able to keep somewhat of a level head in a verbal confrontation.  this guy couldnt.