So I've looked at §134-51  Deadly weapons (http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol03_ch0121-0200d/HRS0134/HRS_0134-0051.HTM) and I'm trying to clear up some of the definitions of the language used. I'm thinking the best bet would be to email someone "important" at HPD and if they give me the "go ahead" to keep that email with me.

#1) "Dagger" - According to Wikipedia (not the most reliable source, I know), a "dagger" is a "double-edged blade used for hitting, stabbing, or thrusting." If I have a Becker BK-7 (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B001IPMG8K/?tag=2ahawaii-20) in my vehicle, am I in violation of the law? I could just get a 9" dive knife and carry, but I'm just curious as to what exactly they consider a dagger versus a utility knife.

#2) "Police club" or "Truncheon" - According to Wikipedia, this appears to include expandable batons. Correct?

I tried to search around for this topic on the forum, but wasn't able to locate a thread that discussed it. If it has been, please redirect me and I apologize for the repeat thread.

- Alex

Your knife is not double edged, it would need to have a sharpened edge on both sides to be a dagger. However, you also have to look at how the knife is marketed -- utilitly, sporting, hunting, defense ect.  This is not legal advice -but some guys I have spoke to said it was ok to keep in the car (fixed blades ect) but dont carry it. I have shown my sog knife to many police when I was serving papers and they never said anything to me.
 
Don't keep the baton it's a weapon. No way around that one to be honest.  That said... who would know.

Many statues have "Case Notes" to help explain the current interpretatons of the law based on prior cases. In this case this instance the case notes contain some useful information.
     

Probable cause for violation of section when police officer saw gun in vehicle stopped for speeding.  430 F.2d 58.
License to carry weapon as justification.  10 H. 585.
Weapons discovered in automobile lawfully stopped for traffic offense; legality of search and seizure considered.  50 H. 461, 443 P.2d 149.
Mentioned in connection with arrest without warrant after seeing pistol in automobile.  52 H. 497, 479 P.2d 800.
"Other deadly or dangerous weapon" is limited to instruments whose sole design and purpose is to inflict bodily injury or death.  55 H. 531, 523 P.2d 299.
A "diver's knife" is neither a "dangerous weapon" nor a "dagger".  "Deadly and dangerous weapon" is one designed primarily as a weapon or diverted from normal use and prepared for combat.  56 H. 374, 537 P.2d 14.
Cane, butterfly and kitchen knives are not deadly or dangerous weapons.  56 H. 642, 547 P.2d 587.  Sheathed sword-cane and wooden knuckles with shark's teeth were "deadly or dangerous weapons".  58 H. 514, 572 P.2d 1222.
Statute does not require that weapons be "concealed" within the vehicle.  58 H. 514, 572 P.2d 1222.
Vehicle stop being proper, seizure of weapons in plain view was authorized.  58 H. 514, 572 P.2d 1222.
Shotgun is a deadly or dangerous weapon.  61 H. 135, 597 P.2d 210.
A .22 caliber rifle is a "deadly or dangerous weapon."  63 H. 147, 621 P.2d 384.
Nunchaku sticks are not per se deadly or dangerous weapons.  64 H. 485, 643 P.2d 546.
The crime underlying a subsection (b) offense is, as a matter of law, an included offense of the subsection (b) offense, within the meaning of §701-109(4)(a), and defendant should not have been convicted of both the subsection (b) offense and the underlying second degree murder offense; thus, defendant’s conviction of the subsection (b) offense reversed.  88 H. 407, 967 P.2d 239.
"Billy" as used in this section refers to "policeman’s club" or "truncheon"; a club-like implement designed for purpose of striking or killing fish is not a "billy"; section extends only to weapons deadly or dangerous to people.  10 H. App. 404, 876 P.2d 1348.
Cited:  10 H. App. 584, 880 P.2d 213.

    

i thought carrying a pocket knife or knives were legal?!  i talked to a local gun store owner and he told me the 3 inch blade rule on pocket knives was changed to no blade size limit last year, basically he told me that you can carry anything on you even a tomahawk! (which he says he carries it on him when he walks his dog!) and he mentioned the above items like the dirk, dagger, blackjack, etc were illegal.  so is it legal to carry a cold steel spartan and a spyderco tenacious on you?

i thought carrying a pocket knife or knives were legal?!  i talked to a local gun store owner and he told me the 3 inch blade rule on pocket knives was changed to no blade size limit last year, basically he told me that you can carry anything on you even a tomahawk! (which he says he carries it on him when he walks his dog!) and he mentioned the above items like the dirk, dagger, blackjack, etc were illegal.  so is it legal to carry a cold steel spartan and a spyderco tenacious on you?

The current statue does not mention blade length, and it has been that way for a while. Not just a year. Who ever said that was probably confused and thinking about the bill introduced by Les Ihara that would have banned many of the knives many of us currently carry. But they are correct in that you can strap a large fixed blade to your belt and carry it without breaking any laws...

So do we have any kind of case notes to specify what HPD considers a "dagger?" Wikipedia is great, but I don't see myself being able to pull out a printed version of the Wiki for "dagger" and showing it to the cop and being good to go.

- Alex

So do we have any kind of case notes to specify what HPD considers a "dagger?" Wikipedia is great, but I don't see myself being able to pull out a printed version of the Wiki for "dagger" and showing it to the cop and being good to go.

That is a good question. From what I could see in the law, it is kept vague on purpose. Like many of the other laws, I feel that there is a big grey area when it comes to whether a knife is a dagger or dirk.

Oh, yeah, IANAL

If you want to be absolutely sure, get a "diver's knife" as prior cases have determined, as noted in the case notes, that such a knife is not a dagger. Out side that, it is, and until a better definition is put in statue, or another case generates guidence via additional case notes, it is a crap shoot....just remember, you can get arrested and hauled off to jail for almost anything...in the end, the police might not charge you and let you out without prosecuting the case, but you still spent some time in jail. That being said, I think it would be difficult to pursue a case of someone having a Ka-bar and the police arresting him for a dagger. But, if it happens, like anyother time you are arrested, shut up. Don't say anything. Especially about the knife being a self defense tool....let your lawyer do the talking.

The more you ask "them" the more restrictive it can be.
 
I like wiggle room when the PD is involved.
 
Years ago, before the definitions we have now, a friend's home was burgled.
 
I was with him when he got the call and went with him to Pearl City PD.
 
Between the 2 of us, I think we were carrying 7 or 8 folding knives and several Original Bali-Songs
 
I was wearing a Loud Aloha shirt (as usual), he was wearing a tuck in shirt.
 
HPD had a Cow as they could see what he had on him.  Then, they looked at me,
 
I didn't say a word and they didn't ask.......
 
 

The more you ask "them" the more restrictive it can be.
 
I like wiggle room when the PD is involved.
 
Years ago, before the definitions we have now, a friend's home was burgled.
 
I was with him when he got the call and went with him to Pearl City PD.
 
Between the 2 of us, I think we were carrying 7 or 8 folding knives and several Original Bali-Songs
 
I was wearing a Loud Aloha shirt (as usual), he was wearing a tuck in shirt.
 
HPD had a Cow as they could see what he had on him.  Then, they looked at me,
 
I didn't say a word and they didn't ask.......

Always carry - never tell!

Daggers are knives with blades on two sides.

Daggers are knives with blades on two sides.

...except if it's a diving knife

You haven't seen my diving knife
 
Looks like a 3/4 size version of what Crocodile Dundee had in New York.  Most likely I'd get arrested for
being offensively armed.  Wonder if I still have that?