Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back (Read 17502 times)

omnigun

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #60 on: October 25, 2020, 10:25:22 PM »
actually, studies have shown that gen z is already more conservative than millenials...

From what I can tell they are still just as or less religious though....

https://www.deseret.com/indepth/2020/9/13/21428404/gen-z-religion-spirituality-social-justice-black-lives-matter-parents-family-pandemic
https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/generational-cohort/
https://www.barna.com/research/atheism-doubles-among-generation-z/

On a side note
https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/essay/on-the-cusp-of-adulthood-and-facing-an-uncertain-future-what-we-know-about-gen-z-so-far/

It appears Gen Z are even more different than millennials.  Who are already moving away from the GOP.   Look at climate change.  GOP denies it but most Gen Z thinks it exists.  Will they support a party that denies it or one that doesnt?

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #61 on: October 25, 2020, 10:56:28 PM »
You are correct they have every right to do that.  And everyone has every right to not vote for them.   Then we will have America mirror the Hawaiian islands politically.  Do you want that?   In the end only votes matter,  that means you must try and cater to the majority of voters.

Your predictions are based on what?  Your opinions?  Someone else's opinions?

If the party needs to adapt IN THE FUTURE for a population that is not aligning with the party of the past, they will adapt.  You're asking if that adaptation needs to chase some study's findings based on some questionnaires?  Not a good way to run a party.  Parties have core values.  Either YOU like them or YOU don't.  If enough people like the core values, I don't see a problem.

One of the problems with the Democrats is they try to be all things to all demographics.  That's impossible.  They failed to live up to their promises, which is one reason so many have left them.

Also, it's a fact that younger people, in spite of all the rhetoric about their political leanings, historically do not vote in large numbers.  Why chase a voting block that doesn't vote?
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #62 on: October 25, 2020, 10:59:19 PM »
From what I can tell they are still just as or less religious though....

https://www.deseret.com/indepth/2020/9/13/21428404/gen-z-religion-spirituality-social-justice-black-lives-matter-parents-family-pandemic
https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/generational-cohort/
https://www.barna.com/research/atheism-doubles-among-generation-z/

On a side note
https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/essay/on-the-cusp-of-adulthood-and-facing-an-uncertain-future-what-we-know-about-gen-z-so-far/

It appears Gen Z are even more different than millennials.  Who are already moving away from the GOP.   Look at climate change.  GOP denies it but most Gen Z thinks it exists.  Will they support a party that denies it or one that doesnt?

Show me where the GOP denies Climate Change exists.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #63 on: October 25, 2020, 11:19:16 PM »
I find it telling, and kind of humorous, that a thread on millennials and religion now encompasses Climate Change.

As many will agree, if you have to believe in Climate Change, or any other theory regarding nature, then the science has obviously failed to support the theories.

Science doesn't require belief.  It requires facts and proof.  Perhaps OminGod has unwittingly included Climate Change because it's more like a religion.  You must believe in it or deny it's existence, because the science can't answer all the questions critical thinking minds have on the topic.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Brystont1

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #65 on: October 26, 2020, 09:04:13 AM »
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/climate-change-and-republicans-congress-global-warming-2019-2%3famp

Yeah, that doesn’t say what you think it does.

I didn’t bother reading the entire article, but I did read the first few republicans and no where does it say “we deny climate change exists.” The problem has always been whether or not legislation is the best way to combat climate change. All the models predicting a timeline of what could happen have all been wrong. The science is very much  unsettled still.

“ In the past, dozens of Republican lawmakers have expressed doubts about the scientific reasoning behind passing legislation to mitigate the effects of climate change.” Not sure how you can read that and come to the conclusion that republicans “deny climate change.”

drck1000

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #66 on: October 26, 2020, 09:12:07 AM »
Yeah, that doesn’t say what you think it does.

I didn’t bother reading the entire article, but I did read the first few republicans and no where does it say “we deny climate change exists.” The problem has always been whether or not legislation is the best way to combat climate change. All the models predicting a timeline of what could happen have all been wrong. The science is very much  unsettled still.

“ In the past, dozens of Republican lawmakers have expressed doubts about the scientific reasoning behind passing legislation to mitigate the effects of climate change.” Not sure how you can read that and come to the conclusion that republicans “deny climate change.”
Also who pays for it and at what proportion.  Context is key.

Yeah, 100% there are folks that deny climate change exists.  I am dealing with them at work.  "oh, I haven't seen the water levels come up in the 30 years I have worked at XXXX". 

omnigun

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #67 on: October 26, 2020, 09:20:15 AM »
Yeah, that doesn’t say what you think it does.

I didn’t bother reading the entire article, but I did read the first few republicans and no where does it say “we deny climate change exists.” The problem has always been whether or not legislation is the best way to combat climate change. All the models predicting a timeline of what could happen have all been wrong. The science is very much  unsettled still.

“ In the past, dozens of Republican lawmakers have expressed doubts about the scientific reasoning behind passing legislation to mitigate the effects of climate change.” Not sure how you can read that and come to the conclusion that republicans “deny climate change.”

Inhofe has called climate change the “greatest hoax ever perpetrated on the American people,” has said God, not humans, controls the weather.

Upton in 2011 admitting the climate is changing, but declining to accept that humans have played a role in it. “I have said many times, and there was a report a couple of weeks ago that in fact you look at this last year, it was the warmest year in the last decade, I think was the numbers that came out,” Upton says. “I don’t – I accept that. I do not say that it is man-made.”

Ted Cruz said “The last 15 years, there has been no recorded warming,” Cruz said in a February 2014 interview with CNN. “Contrary to all the theories that – that they are expounding, there should have been warming over the last 15 years. It hasn’t happened.”

Brystont1

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #68 on: October 26, 2020, 09:20:48 AM »
Also who pays for it and at what proportion.  Context is key.

Yeah, 100% there are folks that deny climate change exists.  I am dealing with them at work.  "oh, I haven't seen the water levels come up in the 30 years I have worked at XXXX".

I honestly don’t think I’ve ever heard someone outright deny climate change exists. Most of the time people will just point to the fact that all the models have been wrong. And when the “experts” continually get their predictions wrong they lose credibility.

omnigun

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #69 on: October 26, 2020, 09:22:37 AM »
Also who pays for it and at what proportion.  Context is key.

Yeah, 100% there are folks that deny climate change exists.  I am dealing with them at work.  "oh, I haven't seen the water levels come up in the 30 years I have worked at XXXX".

The problem with this is then nothing happens.  USA never changes if we keep pointing to china and saying but they are not doing anything so why should we?  The world isnt fair even if the USA suffers economically for a little while it saves the world and is actually a hedge bet for the future as we will be far ahead of places like china.  Then we can sell them all our goods for them to catch up.

It doesn't have to be a negative.  Everyone's looking at this as I cant frack so I don't have a job.  They should look at it, as I cant frack so I get a different job. Our economy can change,  our people can innovate and we can be the beacon of light and success in the world.  If we are the first that means we take lead,  we innovate, we evolve.  Then we can sell everyone our fruits of our effort and get rich and prosperous in the long term.

I deal with this all the time at work people trying to refuse change cause they don't like change.  Why use computers paper is good enough...when everything can be made better with electronics.  Their own job get easier and more efficient but they cant see it.

drck1000

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #70 on: October 26, 2020, 09:30:37 AM »
I honestly don’t think I’ve ever heard someone outright deny climate change exists. Most of the time people will just point to the fact that all the models have been wrong. And when the “experts” continually get their predictions wrong they lose credibility.
Haha.  Don't get me started on the models, as well as when certain agencies adopt a policy for implementing guidance on how to accommodate climate change.  Clear as effing mud, but it was passed by Congress, so have to implement.  Tough to counter when the "experts" can't even answer clarifying questions on their own policies. 

BTW, if you want the contact info for a few who outfight deny climate change exists, let me know.  The more they are distracted with "other things" (i.e. talking to you about it), the less they are bugging me about it.   :rofl:

drck1000

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #71 on: October 26, 2020, 09:36:43 AM »
The problem with this is then nothing happens.  USA never changes if we keep pointing to china and saying but they are not doing anything so why should we?  The world isnt fair even if the USA suffers economically for a little while it saves the world and is actually a hedge bet for the future as we will be far ahead of places like china.  Then we can sell them all our goods for them to catch up.

It doesn't have to be a negative.  Everyone's looking at this as I cant frack so I don't have a job.  They should look at it, as I cant frack so I get a different job. Our economy can change,  our people can innovate and we can be the beacon of light and success in the world.  If we are the first that means we take lead,  we innovate, we evolve.  Then we can sell everyone our fruits of our effort and get rich and prosperous in the long term.

I deal with this all the time at work people trying to refuse change cause they don't like change.  Why use computers paper is good enough...when everything can be made better with electronics.  Their own job get easier and more efficient but they cant see it.
First, I didn't say "nothing is happening".  There are changes, concrete changes. 

Second, I never said all of it is a negative.  However, if I'm going to pay for something, I want it to be based on facts.  Not just some corrupt politicians in bed with those who stand to gain from US paying more.  I'll give you one guess who that is. . .

I too deal with that "we've always done it this way" mentality at work, also in life.  Yeah, it's frustrating, but that's life.  Again, I believe (my personal assessment) your unapologetic approach turns off more people to your "cause" that would otherwise be supportive.  I can say that from personal experience I probably was closer to that when I first became a manager in my late 20's and early 30's.  You may believe it works because it fits in what you feel is right and wrong, and won't settle for less.  Again, I can tell you from experience that "even if win, you lose".  Mr. Miyagi was one wise sensei. . .

robtmc

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #72 on: October 26, 2020, 11:01:25 AM »
I find it telling, and kind of humorous, that a thread on millennials and religion now encompasses Climate Change.
IIRC, that is what that weird kid first showed  up proselytizing about. 

His millennial sense of "he's right and everyone not agreeing is wrong" oozes from everything I see from quotes here.

Hence being blocked as juvenile noise.

« Last Edit: October 26, 2020, 11:08:28 AM by robtmc »

omnigun

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #73 on: October 26, 2020, 11:07:26 AM »
First, I didn't say "nothing is happening".  There are changes, concrete changes. 

Second, I never said all of it is a negative.  However, if I'm going to pay for something, I want it to be based on facts.  Not just some corrupt politicians in bed with those who stand to gain from US paying more.  I'll give you one guess who that is. . .

I too deal with that "we've always done it this way" mentality at work, also in life.  Yeah, it's frustrating, but that's life.  Again, I believe (my personal assessment) your unapologetic approach turns off more people to your "cause" that would otherwise be supportive.  I can say that from personal experience I probably was closer to that when I first became a manager in my late 20's and early 30's.  You may believe it works because it fits in what you feel is right and wrong, and won't settle for less.  Again, I can tell you from experience that "even if win, you lose".  Mr. Miyagi was one wise sensei. . .

Perhaps my way does turn people off.  I am trying to transition to management and I agree you do need different styles because you no longer just have yourself to worry about.  But I also feel that a bunch of people are trying the "apologetic" approach and its not really working.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #74 on: October 26, 2020, 01:18:23 PM »
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/climate-change-and-republicans-congress-global-warming-2019-2%3famp

Since when are 130 members of Congress "The GOP."

The GOP is a very large body of leaders and registered voters. 

Try again:  Show me where THE GOP denies climate change exists, and not just that they deny manmade climate change is the cause -- two distinct and different beliefs.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #75 on: October 26, 2020, 01:24:23 PM »
Perhaps my way does turn people off.  I am trying to transition to management and I agree you do need different styles because you no longer just have yourself to worry about.  But I also feel that a bunch of people are trying the "apologetic" approach and its not really working.

You can't be a good leader until you are a good follower.

You don't seem to want to follow anyone you disagree with.  How the heck do you expect anyone who disagrees with you to follow your lead?

Or, will you just get them fired and only have a bubble of likeminded people in your group?
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

omnigun

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #76 on: October 26, 2020, 01:38:29 PM »
You can't be a good leader until you are a good follower.

You don't seem to want to follow anyone you disagree with.  How the heck do you expect anyone who disagrees with you to follow your lead?

Or, will you just get them fired and only have a bubble of likeminded people in your group?

Contrary to popular belief I think I get along with most people even if I don't think they are correct.   I don't dislike anyone here just that we all have different opinions.  I am perfectly able to follow orders but you are all my peers not my boss.

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #77 on: October 26, 2020, 01:42:20 PM »
Contrary to popular belief I think I get along with most people even if I don't think they are correct.   I don't dislike anyone here just that we all have different opinions.  I am perfectly able to follow orders but you are all my peers not my boss.

We're your peers?

I think you just insulted everyone here .... except EEF.

Quote
Definition of peer (Entry 1 of 3)
   1: one that is of equal standing with another : EQUAL
       The band mates welcomed the new member as a peer.
       especially : one belonging to the same societal group especially based on age, grade, or status

teenagers spending time with their peers
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw

omnigun

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #78 on: October 26, 2020, 01:45:14 PM »
We're your peers?

I think you just insulted everyone here .... except EEF.

Yes....I think of everyone here as friends,  you know equals....do you think of yourself as everyone's supervisor here?  Or do you have a God complex?

>status
You know we are all gun loving Americans. 

Flapp_Jackson

Re: Millennials Are Leaving Religion And Not Coming Back
« Reply #79 on: October 26, 2020, 01:47:45 PM »
Yes....I think of everyone here as friends,  you know equals....do you think of yourself as everyone's supervisor here?  Or do you have a God complex?

One of the criteria in the definition I posted is "age".

You've demonstrated several times you think "old people" don't embrace technology like "young people", and that your school-based knowledge is superior to years of experience.

You don't see us as peers.  You see us as inferior.  Your constant arguing is proof enough, and your comments specific to age highlights the reason.
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
-- George Bernard Shaw