Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range (Read 51189 times)

Echo5Alpha

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2010, 12:09:34 AM »
Here is the letter I received from the parks department:
Quote
  Thank you for your email of September 30, 2010, regarding your concerns of  reduced hours of operation at the Koko Head Shooting Complex.
As you may already know, the current condition of the City's finances has placed
budgetary constraints on all City departments. The furloughing of staff and reduced
hours of operation at most Department of Parks and Recreation (DPR) facilities have
been set in place as temporary fixes to address the City's budget crisis.
Users of the Koko Head Shooting Complex and other DPR facilities have shared
their ideas on the willingness to be charged a fee. The idea behind this would be that
the monies collected for use at the facility would be re-funneled back into funding the
operational hours and maintenance. Unfortunately, the City's current fiscal procedures
do not allow monies collected at our DPR facilities to be placed in special accounts for
each facility. Presently, all monies collected for facility use go into the City's general
trust fund. Our staff will continue to pursue the option of "fee for service" as one
possible venue in generating revenue for facility operations.
Our staff understands your concerns and will continue to work towards providing
the services you need even with the current fiscal constraints. We appreciate your
understanding and patience as well as your suggestions on how we can provide
optimum services with our current resources. [/l][/l]

It was signed by Lester Chang, Director


I'd like to add that I have received the same exact response as well.  Now I know the response was more of a copy and past job.

nf9648

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2010, 04:14:06 PM »
What a time to change the hours, I got there at 8 this morning and didnt get a bench until 1030.  Still the same crowd of guys leaving guns to marinate on benches while they go hang out on the other end of the range while people are waiting to shoot.  A few times I counted 10 benches in a row with guns and nobody sitting behind them.

b.delpilar

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Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2010, 05:16:42 PM »
 :shaka:
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 12:17:50 AM by b.delpilar »

2aHawaii

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Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2010, 07:19:52 PM »
Yeah, that really sucks. The guys who just leave and walk around are the same ones that are there every day, because they can make it out any time they want. Really sucks for those who can only get out once in a while. Well, at least you got out.
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b.delpilar

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Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2010, 07:41:30 PM »
 :shaka:
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 12:18:13 AM by b.delpilar »

Tom_G

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2010, 09:36:52 PM »
Maybe that usage fee we were discussing elsewhere should be a rental instead.  You buy the bench by the half-hour.  I bet that would make a profound difference in how long the bench hogs stayed set up!  Maybe they'd realize that they can get together and talk story without denying other people access. 

Then again, my typical day at the rifle range lasts 3-4 hours.  I might regret offering up such a suggestion!  Besides, looking forward to my retirement years, it would be nice to go out, claim a bench before sunrise, sit around drinking coffee and talking story with my mates, then stretching two boxes of ammo out over an entire day.  Sounds very relaxing!
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Funtimes

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #26 on: October 17, 2010, 09:56:26 PM »
I wish we could rent those outside area's where the gun clubs go.. say 30-40 bucks a hour.. that would be sweet.
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b.delpilar

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Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #27 on: October 17, 2010, 10:21:00 PM »
 :shaka: .


 
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 12:18:30 AM by b.delpilar »

houdni

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #28 on: October 18, 2010, 05:20:45 AM »
hmm...the 2A gun club... :) a non profit organization for the promotion of safe and proper firearms training  ;D

Alex Europa

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #29 on: October 18, 2010, 05:57:29 AM »
What   a time to change the hours, I got there at 8 this morning and didnt get   a bench until 1030.  Still the same crowd of guys leaving guns to   marinate on benches while they go hang out on the other end of the range   while people are waiting to shoot.  A few times I counted 10 benches in   a row with guns and nobody sitting behind them.
 
Yeah, that really sucks. The guys who just leave and walk around are the same ones that are there every day, because they can make it out any time they want. Really sucks for those who can only get out once in a while. Well, at least you got out.

When I go out there I just tend to shoot at the silhouette range so this issue don't really affect me, but I have to ask: Have any of you guys tried TALKING to the guys who do this on a regular basis. While they probably are well aware that other people are waiting to shoot and don't really care, the fact of the matter is that very few people enjoy confrontation, and will generally take the easiest route to avoid any further conflict. They will most likely just acquiesce and either give up their bench or shoot the rest of their ammo and leave.

- Alex

Old Guy

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #30 on: October 18, 2010, 09:03:07 AM »
Range Hogs are one reason I don't go to the rifle side any more. 
 
I don't have the time to waste waiting.  Also, I might say something to Really stir the pot.
Believe me, IF I'm feeling bad or tired because of my medical condition, I have no problems telling people off.
 
So I shoot more handgun with HRA/LIFE at the Fun Shoots
 
Believe me I have several NIB rifles that want to be shot. 
 
Any volunteers to shoot a Custom 375 H & H magnum with 300 gr FMJs or 270 gr SP or 300 gr lead gas checks?
 
How about one of the last Commemorative Winchester 1895 30-06 Special made by Winchester before they closed?
 
Maybe it's time the KK range started puting time limits? 
 
More NEW complaints wouldn't hurt.

b.delpilar

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Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #31 on: October 18, 2010, 09:05:18 AM »
 :shaka:
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 12:18:48 AM by b.delpilar »

808shooter

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #32 on: October 18, 2010, 09:49:55 AM »
maybe they're all shooting the bowling pins in the October rimfire challenge and they did all of their shots? :geekdanc:
 
But seriously, I do see a lot of people not shooting.  Like the free market, it will reach a boiling-over point and something will get done.  Until then, just gotta go early and hope that you get a bench.

nf9648

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #33 on: October 18, 2010, 03:50:24 PM »
 
When I go out there I just tend to shoot at the silhouette range so this issue don't really affect me, but I have to ask: Have any of you guys tried TALKING to the guys who do this on a regular basis. While they probably are well aware that other people are waiting to shoot and don't really care, the fact of the matter is that very few people enjoy confrontation, and will generally take the easiest route to avoid any further conflict. They will most likely just acquiesce and either give up their bench or shoot the rest of their ammo and leave.
- Alex
Ive tried talking nicely to a few guys and giving smartass remarks, they dont seem to care.  To them its their range first and the younger guys need to deal with it.  The guy I was shooting with had an idea that he would bring his entire platoon one morning about 6am and setup on 30 or so benches at about 6am before the old timers get there and shoot all day.

Funtimes

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #34 on: October 18, 2010, 04:40:48 PM »

When I go out there I just tend to shoot at the silhouette range so this issue don't really affect me, but I have to ask: Have any of you guys tried TALKING to the guys who do this on a regular basis. While they probably are well aware that other people are waiting to shoot and don't really care, the fact of the matter is that very few people enjoy confrontation, and will generally take the easiest route to avoid any further conflict. They will most likely just acquiesce and either give up their bench or shoot the rest of their ammo and leave.
- Alex
Ive tried talking nicely to a few guys and giving smartass remarks, they dont seem to care.  To them its their range first and the younger guys need to deal with it.  The guy I was shooting with had an idea that he would bring his entire platoon one morning about 6am and setup on 30 or so benches at about 6am before the old timers get there and shoot all day.

If people did this, just move in on it.  Tell him he wasn't actively shooting on the range and hes been replaced imo.
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Heavies

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #35 on: October 18, 2010, 05:11:55 PM »
Quote
Maybe that usage fee we were discussing elsewhere should be a rental instead.  You buy the bench by the half-hour.  I bet that would make a profound difference in how long the bench hogs stayed set up!  Maybe they'd realize that they can get together and talk story without denying other people access. 

Then again, my typical day at the rifle range lasts 3-4 hours.  I might regret offering up such a suggestion!  Besides, looking forward to my retirement years, it would be nice to go out, claim a bench before sunrise, sit around drinking coffee and talking story with my mates, then stretching two boxes of ammo out over an entire day.  Sounds very relaxing!

Sorry guy's,
I am one of those guy's that take a long time to shoot.  I am going to have to disagree with those who might say that some folks 'take too long'.
 
Load development, sighting in, and practice (especially hunting rifles) takes a long time.  In target rifles, many different loads must be fired.  Sighting in for hunting situations must be done on a clean cold bore.
Some folks don't just go and blast off all their rounds at once.  Some guys like to bench shoot clean wait for the barrel to cool.  We must all be patient and wait our turn.
 
I too don't like to wait for a bench.  That is why I wake up extra early(i live on the otherside of the island).  I usually get there at 6 to 6:30 am to set up.  I'm a working man, and I work night shift, so this is not as easy as it may sound. If I can't get up that early, then I'll just have to wait my turn like everyone else.
 
We need to be coutious and patient.  We are trying to get the public involved with this sport, and we do not want any 'noobies' to be offended or put off by a rude person who thinks they are 'shooting too slow' or 'taking too long'.
 
Renting of the facility by the minute/hour, in my opinion, is a very bad idea.  I have many miles to travel to get to the gun range, and I do not want to spend only a half hour shooting and rushing to finish my session just to keep with in time constraints.  There will defintatly be less shooters if we do this, and even less support for the 2A rights, in this already gun unfreindly state.
 
Might I suggest that the state be petitioned to open more shooting facilities, since the ONLY one we have is so crowded.  This option probably would never be considered, but it is worth a try.  If we make too much of a stink about range time limits and other such stuff, then we may not like the real restrictions that our ridiculous law makers will undoubtably levee. 

Funtimes

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #36 on: October 18, 2010, 05:41:47 PM »
Right Heavies -- but what kind of consideration is it to others, whom may be waiting, if they sit there and watch a bench and a Rifle "cool-off" for a hour +... that's not fair.    Courtesy  goes both ways. The problem with it being "free" is it's not on any persons dime.  Your less likely to waste all of your range time if you paid a fee.

I was also informed today that the range closure was due to Peter Carlisle.
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Posts are not legal advice & are my own, unless said so.

nf9648

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #37 on: October 18, 2010, 05:52:26 PM »
Quote
Maybe that usage fee we were discussing elsewhere should be a rental instead.  You buy the bench by the half-hour.  I bet that would make a profound difference in how long the bench hogs stayed set up!  Maybe they'd realize that they can get together and talk story without denying other people access. 

Then again, my typical day at the rifle range lasts 3-4 hours.  I might regret offering up such a suggestion!  Besides, looking forward to my retirement years, it would be nice to go out, claim a bench before sunrise, sit around drinking coffee and talking story with my mates, then stretching two boxes of ammo out over an entire day.  Sounds very relaxing!

Sorry guy's,
I am one of those guy's that take a long time to shoot.  I am going to have to disagree with those who might say that some folks 'take too long'.
 
Load development, sighting in, and practice (especially hunting rifles) takes a long time.  In target rifles, many different loads must be fired.  Sighting in for hunting situations must be done on a clean cold bore.
Some folks don't just go and blast off all their rounds at once.  Some guys like to bench shoot clean wait for the barrel to cool.  We must all be patient and wait our turn.
 
I too don't like to wait for a bench.  That is why I wake up extra early(i live on the otherside of the island).  I usually get there at 6 to 6:30 am to set up.  I'm a working man, and I work night shift, so this is not as easy as it may sound. If I can't get up that early, then I'll just have to wait my turn like everyone else.
 
We need to be coutious and patient.  We are trying to get the public involved with this sport, and we do not want any 'noobies' to be offended or put off by a rude person who thinks they are 'shooting too slow' or 'taking too long'.
 
Renting of the facility by the minute/hour, in my opinion, is a very bad idea.  I have many miles to travel to get to the gun range, and I do not want to spend only a half hour shooting and rushing to finish my session just to keep with in time constraints.  There will defintatly be less shooters if we do this, and even less support for the 2A rights, in this already gun unfreindly state.
 
Might I suggest that the state be petitioned to open more shooting facilities, since the ONLY one we have is so crowded.  This option probably would never be considered, but it is worth a try.  If we make too much of a stink about range time limits and other such stuff, then we may not like the real restrictions that our ridiculous law makers will undoubtably levee. 

Nobody is knocking "noobies" for taking their time, its the old timers that I have seen every weekend for the last 10 years I have used that range, that hang out in the same group of guys that shoot once or twice every half hour and have a bs session amongst themselves for the remainder.  The courteous thing for these guys to do, since they are already buddies, is to double or triple up on benches so that there is no waiting list at all.  Nobody should have to wait 2+ hours to get a bench, ever.

Heavies

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #38 on: October 18, 2010, 05:56:27 PM »
Quote
Right Heavies -- but what kind of consideration is it to others, whom may be waiting, if they sit there and watch a bench and a Rifle "cool-off" for a hour +... that's not fair.    Courtesy  goes both ways. The problem with it being "free" is it's not on any persons dime.  Your less likely to waste all of your range time if you paid a fee.

I was also informed today that the range closure was due to Peter Carlisle.

Yes, I do agree that some folks really dilly dally around at the range, but who is to say that this person or that person is taking too long?  Too many regulation is one of the reasons we have to fight for our rights to keep and bear arms(among many other issues and regulations we have to put up with no matter how idiotic they are). Someone had to make blanket statements on, and make abitrary disicisions on who does and does not deserve this or that.
 
This, in my opinion, will make it that much easier to controll how, where, when, and how long we are 'allowed' to handle our fireams.
 
I think it best to just be courtous and patient with people. After all We are "Armed With Aloha", aren't we?
 
Not suprised about Carlisle,  Just makes my point more clear, in my eyes.

houdni

Re: Reduced Hours of Operations @ Koko Head Shooting Range
« Reply #39 on: October 18, 2010, 05:57:47 PM »
i hardly see pple shoot prone....but if theres a long bench waiting list on sun. would the bench guys get mad if we shoot prone between them?  :)